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Glennart

For all fruit and vegetable lovers

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Yes I said it. I think fiber sucks.

Fiber Menace site is updated!

People on this board often push supplements like psyllium husks or eating lots of fiber rich greens and vegetables to become "regular". In my opinion this is a very bad thing and is preventing people from obtaining the skin they want and possibly even making their situation worse. And the sad part is that fiber doesn't necessairly increase your transit time, rather it is fat, not fiber that makes you go nr 2.

Energy-rich meals with a high fat content increase motility [the rate of intestinal propulsion]; carbohydrates and proteins have no effect.

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Nevertheless on clinical studies people on Atkins complained of long term constipation.

I'm not saying this in favour of fibers (which are known to be effective against constipation only on a 15% of the cases) but questioning the fat hypothesis since there's enough fat oin the Atkins diet but still constipation is a major long term complaints. Not only that but people who do suffer from constipation are known to consume rather high fat diets.

Fibers can't be considered a menace empirically. Majority of hunter-gatherers have a diet high in produce and hence in fibers (as shown by Bushinsky studies) and yet their digestive and intestinal health is perfect and they are now known to suffer from digestive disorder (except if they eat toxic berries or foods that contain poisons)

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I find that i feel best (going regularly) when i get neither too little or too much fiber. If i eat loads of fiber, i cant bloated and constipated and when i eat too little, i dont get as bloated but feel like i have cement in me and hence constipated. I also find that fiber from certain things affect me differently. I find that fiber from sprouted grains and beans keeps me more regular than the fiber from fruit which can bloat me if i have too much of it. I like to eat a a good bit of healthy fat and a nice amount of fiber. Too little of one or the other causes me problems. Olive oil is excellent for keeping regular.

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I've tried high fibre (with food and supplements) and low fibre - and as with everything the trick is balance. Everything in life has both good and bad sides. Too much of anything is a bad thing and a total lack of something can be just as bad. My body works best in balance. Some fibre is good in a balanced diet, but theres no need to supplement it. Water is more important than fibre, as it is essential for the small intestines and also helps increase transit time and it has lots of other import jobs!

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Regarding the atkins diet Danny:

http://www.fibermenace.com/dis/constipation.html

Apparently, that harebrained conjecture about animal fats and constipation came from observing the costivity effect of the Atkins diet. But this fluke has nothing to do with fat, and everything to do with fiber — or, more accurately, with the absence of fiber in low-carb diets. Naturally, stools sans fiber lack the bulk to get coaxed out on their own from a large intestine damaged by years and years of fiber dependence.

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I've tried high fibre (with food and supplements) and low fibre - and as with everything the trick is balance. Everything in life has both good and bad sides. Too much of anything is a bad thing and a total lack of something can be just as bad. My body works best in balance. Some fibre is good in a balanced diet, but theres no need to supplement it. Water is more important than fibre, as it is essential for the small intestines and also helps increase transit time and it has lots of other import jobs!

Agreed

But you’re fooling no one but a glucose meter. In all other respects, the damage will be all the same, or even worse. That's because the carbohydrate load on the cells, liver, pancreas, and kidneys from extended sugar digestion, elevated insulin, and high triglycerides (assimilated fatty acids) is much higher. And that’s even before taking into account the negative impact of fiber on the digestive organs, or hyperinsulinemia and triglycerides on the heart, blood vessels, and blood pressure.

I think that a lot of glucose at once is way worse than the same amount over a couple of hours. That guy hates fiber his guts lol. Its interesting though, I bought his book, still has to be delivered.

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The question is, for the people who have supposedly damaged their intestines from years of consuming fiber, how do we get them working right again so that we can eat a low fiber diet and not be constipated. If the answer is just wait it out that usually is a bad idea. You can't just sit around constipated till your body fixes itself. I've tried diets of zero carbs, 70-80% fat, and would go for days without a BM. I want to believe in and be able to do the ultra low carb diets, but until the constipation issues get resolved I won't be able to stick to them.

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The question is, for the people who have supposedly damaged their intestines from years of consuming fiber, how do we get them working right again so that we can eat a low fiber diet and not be constipated. If the answer is just wait it out that usually is a bad idea. You can't just sit around constipated till your body fixes itself. I've tried diets of zero carbs, 70-80% fat, and would go for days without a BM. I want to believe in and be able to do the ultra low carb diets, but until the constipation issues get resolved I won't be able to stick to them.

well when i eat green apples my stomache hates it..just with 1 apple my stomach hurts a little and i get HORRIBLE gas(sorry to be nasty) and constipated...so i decided to cut out the green apples which i love.

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It should be pointeed out that the author of fibermenace is just talking about added fibers like supplements, kellogs, bran, husk and those sort of things. He clearly states that the amount of fibers we get from eating fresh unprocessed foods like veggies and fruits and nuts is absolutely not a problem.

There's a contradiction in the Atkins thing though.

It's very flawed to claim that people on Atkins suffered constipation because their body got dependent on high fiber quantity for the simple reason that the standard american diet is just devoid of fibers and the majority of the population (unless fibers are consciously supplements) just has a very poor intake of fibers. Most people goes to Atkins after switching from a diet of sweets, fast foods, grilled meats and refined flour. This is also the contraction of fibermenace

The only reason why it is very questionable that people suffer colitis, diverticulitis, hemmoroids, chron disease because of high fiber consumption is the simple fact that the majority of people suffering from these constipation is not consuming excessive fibers and consume diets devoid of fibers mostly comprised of refined foods.

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It should be pointeed out that the author of fibermenace is just talking about added fibers like supplements, kellogs, bran, husk and those sort of things. He clearly states that the amount of fibers we get from eating fresh unprocessed foods like veggies and fruits and nuts is absolutely not a problem.

Well he recommends eating thos items in sensible amounts!

Not like the FDA saying we should eat 30-40 g fiber per day! He says the upper limit is somewhere around 15 g. But this is for healthy people. For those suffering from previous digestive problems a much lower intake is recommended.

The question is, for the people who have supposedly damaged their intestines from years of consuming fiber, how do we get them working right again so that we can eat a low fiber diet and not be constipated. If the answer is just wait it out that usually is a bad idea. You can't just sit around constipated till your body fixes itself. I've tried diets of zero carbs, 70-80% fat, and would go for days without a BM. I want to believe in and be able to do the ultra low carb diets, but until the constipation issues get resolved I won't be able to stick to them.

I can't remember exactly what he says in the book. (I only have this information second hand). But I think he says to slowly reduce the amount of fiber in your diet to alow the bowels to adapt.

When you ate a no-carb diet did you get hard dry stools?

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the optimal ammount of fiber is 0.

When I eat grains, white rice gives me the least problems, yes even compared to wholegrains like brown rice, whole wheat etc.

Thats a good webpage, thx for it.

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Not like the FDA saying we should eat 30-40 g fiber per day! He says the upper limit is somewhere around 15 g. But this is for healthy people. For those suffering from previous digestive problems a much lower intake is recommended.

15 grams of fiber is the equivalent of 3 pears--way too little, in my opinion. There are different types of fiber, which I think Fibermenace seems to have glossed over.

I like my vegetables, so I'll keep on getting my 15 + grams.

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Overhydration (the actual opposite of dehydration) rarely happens. It is most common in endurance events, I have heard of it on some long biking events.

You should be drinking around 2L a day, more if you do physical activity. I might start to agree about water if youre drinking like 5 or 6L, basically way more than you need, but until then... no.

And I have not seen anything bad about fiber except from one or two websites/books. I could find one or two websites to support almost anything.

You seem to buy into the fact that there is bad info on nutriotion way too easily.

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This is one of the reasons I think a low carbohydrate is effective against acne.

A low carb diet is also (in most cases) a low fiber diet and thereby starves pathogens in the gut and lessens fermentation. This leads to improved digestion and assimilation of food and reduction of toxins created in your bowel.

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Uh more like no stools honestly. Basically no urge to go, then I get like paranoid thinking I should be going and what not. I just don't feel healthy not going at least once per day. Maybe the "slow reduction" is worth a try instead of the cold turkey approach. I really would like to be able to pull off that diet though, bowel function is really the only thing that gets in my way.

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going a day (or even more) without a bowel movement isnt a problem. Its what happens when u have those bowel movements. I dont have frequent bowel movements but when I do they are very easy. That is not constipation, constipation is having difficulty going. The less frequent bowel movements is because you are absorbing more of the food you eat (on a low fiber diet), it is not "backed up" in your colon. Less waste, lest shit.

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Basically no urge to go, then I get like paranoid thinking I should be going and what not. I just don't feel healthy not going at least once per day.

My doctor said that if you aren't regular, the toxins "go to your brain." Of course, it also hurts more if you haven't gone in a few days.

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my doctor said if u arent regular the toxins turn into zombies and eat your brain

What an idiotic response.

It is possible for toxins accumulated in the intestines to enter the bloodstream and into the brain. The body gets rid of fecal matter for a reason.

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Whenever I think about it I think about animals, are there animals that go for days without a bowel movement? I'm not saying we are the same of course, but as far as the necessity of regular bowel movements to overall health you would think we could decide by looking at the animal kingdom?

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It depends on the animal. Bears, for example, don't defecate a lot while they hibernate since their bodies can turn the solid waste into fat. Our bodies don't have that amazing ability so we need to poo once a day, ideally.

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Hmm, sounds like a recipe for colon cancer.....

http://www.fibermenace.com/main/myth.html#qt_5

There is very little evidence that fiber does anything to prevent cancer.

So would probiotics be a better replacement instead of fiber supplements? Would they work just as well?

I don't know but he recommends probiotics.

Overhydration (the actual opposite of dehydration) rarely happens. It is most common in endurance events, I have heard of it on some long biking events.

You should be drinking around 2L a day, more if you do physical activity. I might start to agree about water if youre drinking like 5 or 6L, basically way more than you need, but until then... no.

By overhydration he means chronic consumption of more water than needed and not acute water poisoning that happens to athletes.

You seem to buy into the fact that there is bad info on nutriotion way too easily.

Your saying that I buy into the idea that bad nutritional information exists?

Did you mean to write: You buy into the bad nutrition info out there way to easily. ?

Im assuming that you did.

What does it matter if only a few websites promote this kind of treatment? What matters is who is wrong and who is right. You have not provided any usefull information at all. You obviously did not care to read any of the information and have already decided that fiber is your best friend. Good luck.

Uh more like no stools honestly. Basically no urge to go, then I get like paranoid thinking I should be going and what not. I just don't feel healthy not going at least once per day. Maybe the "slow reduction" is worth a try instead of the cold turkey approach. I really would like to be able to pull off that diet though, bowel function is really the only thing that gets in my way.

Here is what your doctor should have actually told you:

Fecal Engineering Primer

Ideally, dear, you should have defecation every day, preferably after each major meal. If your large intestine is already been stretched out by fiber and you have nerve damage, this ideal frequency is unfortunately no longer attainable. Still, depending on your age, you should move bowels at least every other day, so your stools don't get a chance to enlarge, impact, and dry out.

Constipation has many causes. Major among them are the damage of intestinal flora, or disbacteriosis; the use of fiber to replace dead bacteria; the enlargement of internal hemorrhoids; an unfortunate tendency to withhold stools until a right bathroom is available; the use of laxatives; and the side effect of many commonly-used medicines.

Your age, dear, doesn't affect constipation directly unless you've been experiencing constipation for a long time, and your colon, rectum, and anus had already been irreversibly damaged by large stools. Obviously, the older you are, the more profound the damages. That's why people connect constipation with age.

If your colorectal organs are healthy, a normal diet doesn't play a significant role in constipation, with fiber or without, except for the dietary fat factor. Fat is essential to stimulate defecation. This diet-constipation connection is one of the most difficult to accept, because people commonly equate food with stools.

Read more here: http://www.fibermenace.com/dis/constipation.html

And here: http: //www.fibermenace.com/dis/transition.html

My doctor said that if you aren't regular, the toxins "go to your brain." Of course, it also hurts more if you haven't gone in a few days.

Your doctor is crazy.

I agree with this part 100%:

A common suggestion to œcleanse the large intestine with fiber or herbal laxatives is a worse form of quackery. Instead of helping, the herbal laxatives are actually contributing to constipation and colorectal damage because they irritate the intestinal mucosa, damage the nerve endings, kill intestinal bacteria, cause painful cramping, and may provoke severe diarrhea.

œCleansing with insoluble fiber, such as bran, is even more dangerous, because undigested fiber keeps piling up on top of already impacted, hardened stools. This may lead to obstruction, fecal impaction, and other complications, such as diverticular disease, megacolon, prolapsed hemorrhoids, or colon perforation ” which is a mostly lethal condition.

The natural œcleansing kits that provide a double- or triple punch”a combination of stimulant laxatives, such as senna; soluble fiber, such as psyllium husk; and insoluble fiber, such as bran”are the most dangerous. They may do the œtrick for someone with relatively intact and unobstructed colorectal organs, but someone with a longer history of constipation may end up in the ER either because of intense cramping, or allergic reaction, or severe diarrhea, or impenetrable obstruction, or colon perforation, or combinations of all of the above.

In essence, sending triple-laxatives down into the dysfunctional colon is like blowing more and more helium into the balloon ” it can only expand so much before it will blow up.

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It still remains a fact that population that consume way more than 15 grams of fibers suffer from digestive complain or constipation. In fact many people who find long-term digestive relief switching from a standard american diet to one of the healthier options out there (zone diet, paleodiet, e2l and so on) consume way more fibers than that without ill consequences.

Even Mark's Apple author combine common low-carb paleodiet ideas with a diet dominated by veggies and fruits and still at the age of 54 is in absolute great health. Same thing for Art DeVany which if I remember right is 70 years old. In fact many Atkins eaters themselves who claim to have found digestive conford eat way more fibers than 15g, after all greens and fibrous vegetables are unlimited in the Atkins diet and many do a very veggie-rich Atkins kind.

The problem with all the theories coming out lately is that if they were even remotely true we would see only a very small amount of people improving their healthy and only one approach working. Instead the truth is that WHATEVER approach that moves us away from a diet made of refined, toxic, , additive foods and teach us to eat fresh natural nutritious foods WORKS.

And this is the reason why millions of approach work and why there are millions of different diets with millions of different ratio of nutrients and foods that give SAME IDENTICAL RESULTS and give people same identical natural birth-right health.

Besides if all these theories of micromanaging and tight upper-limits were true we would have extincted lot of time before since while it's true that we can all follow a simple criteria like "eat only the freshest and natural foods which is available to you" no one could ever follow such close guidelines in regards to fatty acids, fibers, amount of this or that ... (except us rich western mofo)

By the way: I do know the SCD diet and have been involved with the SCD community for some time. As I remember vegetables and fruits are in the legal list and they can be eaten at libitum and are often a staple on the diets of people following the SCD. The only limitation was to cook all vegetables for the first couple of months in the diet but to reintroduce raw veggies later on the diet.

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