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tornado_chaser

Acne = Genetics

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I have only been a member of this forum for a few months, so I won't argue against how easy it would be to discredit my argument. After reading numerous posts in this specific forum, through my personal acne history, and observations in my life, I have come to the same conclusion that many others have (most of this is a restatement of people's findings and have stated it in this forum - so they deserve the credit).

Acne is a result of a sub-par liver. It's not your diet, hormones, or impaired bowels directly. Though they influence the result by extremely stressing your sub-par liver.

Before you hit the "reply" button to argue, here is why:

Some important liver responsibilities:

- filter the blood to remove large toxins (from the environment and within the body - including bowels)

- synthesize and secrete bile full of cholesterol and other fat-soluble toxins (gallstones impair this process)

- enzymatically disassemble unwanted chemicals.

- regulate blood sugar

- regulate hormone levels

How to aid your liver in doing its job: (less work/stress on your sub-par liver)

- Proper diet (inclusive of everyone's thoughts and diet regimens on this forum)

- exercise (we already know this)

- relieve stress (we already know this)

Why is it a sub-par liver then?

It's not directly your diet because:

1. Children don't have acne. This is a critical point to my argument.

2. Old people usually don't have acne. Hormone levels have subsided by this point.

3. There are many people who have terrible eating habits and don't have acne

It's not directly your hormones because:

1. Not everyone has acne while going through puberty

Acne occurs with a person that has a sub-par liver because of:

a.) Increased hormones

b.) Increased stress

c.) Improper diet and toxins that stress liver function

d.) any combination of the above

Simple Examples:

- A person with a terrible diet starts puberty. The liver cannot handle the diet and the increase in hormones. The result is acne.

- A person with a terrible diet has exited puberty and the hormone levels have subsided. Acne goes away if liver is able to handle terrible diet and new hormone level. (personal experience).

- A person with a terrible diet has an increase in stress. Again, the liver cannot handle this and the result is acne. (personal experience) This happened to me recently. I am now almost clear because of diet changes and stress relieving.

I grew up with 2 brothers, who are within a year of my age. We ate the same type of food and similar amounts. Lived in the same environment. Lived the same lifestyle (exercise, sleeping patterns, entertainment, etc). I had acne during puberty, they didn't. My genetics gave me a liver that is sub-par.

Well how can a liver be sub-par?

Easy. This is just as similiar as people who have impaired hearing, have near-sightedness, soft teeth, etc. Your DNA is to blame, its instructions were to create your liver. Your DNA is unique, as is your liver.

Someone with a terrible diet who has perfect skin most likely has an excellent liver. Someone who has severe acne and maintains a liver-friendly diet, most likely has a poor liver. But, that person with a poor liver may have 20/20 vision and the person with an excellent liver may be near-sighted.

What can be done to bring your liver up to par?

Well, you can't change your liver, unless you figure out how to modify DNA. What you can do is help your liver. Most people in this forum are helping their liver through diet, by eating a diet that allows the liver to spend more time removing toxins, regulating blood sugar, and removing hormones. Also, supplements can also work in tandem with the liver by lowering blood sugar, removing waste faster, etc....(fiber sounds like a winner there).

Also, eliminating gallstones could improve your liver function, though I haven't tried a liver flush yet. I am going to try a liver flush later this year, because I have a sub-par liver and I believe that by removing any potential gallstones that I may have, I will be improving my liver function.

References:

- This forum!

- Personal experiences and observations

- http://www.doctormurray.com/articles/silybin.htm (some liver responsibility info)

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This makes perfect sense to me. Common sense, even, it's a wonder why there isn't a lot more research done on it.

One of the great mysteries of my body is why I had appendecitis at such a young age (9 years old) and then got acne a year or two after. Liver problems? I think so.

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.... and wouldn't taking supplements be the worst thing to do for acne then? Because supplements are hard for the liver to break down, I've been told. All these people here (including myself) who take vitamins, zinc, B5 overdosing - all of that stuff could just be forcing the liver to work even harder and maybe prevent it from detoxing itself.

Check out this site I just found:

http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/liver/DG00038

"Beware of certain supplements. Herbal supplements that can be toxic to the liver include kava, comfrey, chaparral, kombucha tea, pennyroyal and skullcap. Also avoid high doses of vitamins A, D, E and K."

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great post. i agree to 90%. i agree that genetic predisposition plays a role. but i do not agree that we all have a sub-par liver. what might be the case is that our DNA does not tolerate certain foods of which we have consumed too of, therefore our liver has had to work overtime over the last decades or so.

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.... and wouldn't taking supplements be the worst thing to do for acne then? Because supplements are hard for the liver to break down, I've been told. All these people here (including myself) who take vitamins, zinc, B5 overdosing - all of that stuff could just be forcing the liver to work even harder and maybe prevent it from detoxing itself.
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You really have no clue what you are talking about. It could be possible that liver disfunction is the problem that causes acne... but your explanation as to why does not fully cover it. I am absolutely postive that genetics predispose people to acne. But your explanation of the genetics are causing a weak liver, and since you have a weak liver you have acne is not based on anything in reality.

The main reason why I am sure that liver disfunction does not cause acne is that people who have truly failing livers do not all of a sudden get acne. And people who are taking medications that are hard on the liver do not all of a sudden get acne. I know 2 people that required liver transplants, and neither had acne, before or after the transplant. And another reason that your thoughts are completely wrong is because when your liver is not functioning properly your body makes less sex hormones, and so therefore your hormonally caused acne would probably not get worse.

But it is possible that something like insulin resistance is causing your acne and hormones to get out of control, and the insulin resistance is damaging your liver and making your liver have to work harder. But that still does not mean that your bad liver is causing your acne.

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I've always thought this ever since my liver started to fail from accutane. I wondered why the degeneration happened so quickly... or was it just bad in the first place? I don't think that the same is true for everyone as far as the liver is concerned, but I do believe that protein metabolism is key in the battle with acne.

I'm done with B5. The diarrhea was too bad. My oil production went way down, but it did not stop the acne from forming.

I don't know about getting away from all of these different food groups though. I've been thinking about my experience with topicals and how they worked so well. Only problem was, after I went off of them, the IB and return would be bad. I'm wondering how that is so much different from diet? If you quit your diet, your acne will return in full bloom.

There has to be another player in this. Something that is lacking the ability to catabolize food properly. Right now, I'm looking into the part that the thyroid gland plays in protein metabolism. It seems interesting that this is the organ which determines sensitivity to other hormones. Could this cause imbalances leading to such diseases as acne? I'll be testing iodine soon to see if there are any positive links (not negative as so many believe). There has to be something to balance the hormones. I don't think the search is fruitless, nor will there be one cure-all. I'll be making a thread later this week or next week to show you guys some research done on iodine findings and it's hormone regulating success. It sounds so weird.

Don't be so closed minded "not" a doctor. The human body and it's vital organs are very fickle. What makes you think that just one segment of the liver could not be dysfunctional? It seems like a very likely scenario to me. I don't believe that tornado_chaser, myself, or even you are aware of the problems that bring about acne. You may think that it is diet, but that is really just a cover-up. Tornado_chaser never mentioned that the "whole" liver was failing. It is very believable to theorize that there must be something awry in it's functioning however.

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You really have no clue what you are talking about. It could be possible that liver disfunction is the problem that causes acne... but your explanation as to why does not fully cover it. I am absolutely postive that genetics predispose people to acne. But your explanation of the genetics are causing a weak liver, and since you have a weak liver you have acne is not based on anything in reality.
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You really have no clue what you are talking about. It could be possible that liver disfunction is the problem that causes acne... but your explanation as to why does not fully cover it. I am absolutely postive that genetics predispose people to acne. But your explanation of the genetics are causing a weak liver, and since you have a weak liver you have acne is not based on anything in reality.

Please provide the info I am missing, since you have no problem bashing my statements without backing yourself up with your theories or facts.

The main reason why I am sure that liver disfunction does not cause acne is that people who have truly failing livers do not all of a sudden get acne. And people who are taking medications that are hard on the liver do not all of a sudden get acne. I know 2 people that required liver transplants, and neither had acne, before or after the transplant. And another reason that your thoughts are completely wrong is because when your liver is not functioning properly your body makes less sex hormones, and so therefore your hormonally caused acne would probably not get worse.

I never said anywhere that if you have a sub-par liver you will get acne. I never had acne as a child. I have been clear for 8 years up until recently. And I am sure that at some point I will be entirely clear again when hormones subside, with my sub-par liver.

It's entirely possible that people with a failing liver may not get acne due to many factors, including they are already old (low hormone levels), or that even though their liver is failing, it is still functioning enough to clean the blood (otherwise they would be dead - duh!).

But it is possible that something like insulin resistance is causing your acne and hormones to get out of control, and the insulin resistance is damaging your liver and making your liver have to work harder. But that still does not mean that your bad liver is causing your acne.
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Wow, you're a jerk. Why did you reply?

Something constructive would be much appreciated.

Tornado, don't stoop to his level. You are on to something. More research, less flaming.

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Neonatal acne, not due to liver function problems. MANY old people have acne, particularly those who continue to have excessive sebum production and/or abnormal keratinization.

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^^^^^^ It is because impaired liver does not cause acne.

I just deleted my second reply. It was a pretty shitty thing to say. You were trying to lay out an idea that you had and obviously put some serious thought into. Your idea is still wrong, but I should not have been an asshole about it.

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^^^^^^ It is because impaired liver does not cause acne.

I just deleted my second reply. It was a pretty shitty thing to say. You were trying to lay out an idea that you had and obviously put some serious thought into. Your idea is still wrong, but I should not have been an asshole about it.

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in my case i know it is the liver. my acne did not turn bad until I took medication (internally & externally) which according to its desrcription should not be taken if you have liver problems. This stuff really killed it.

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Tornado. I don't think that it's the blood. I have met people in the past that have Jaundice and I've been researching the topic because it's all about the liver and how it isn't able to handle all of the toxic input. I haven't seen any of them with acne. I do think that it has to do with the oils being secreted that are mixed with fatty acids that haven't been completely broken down. This, I believe, is the fault of the liver.

Tell me more about why you believe the dirty blood to be at fault.

Also, I was thinking earlier today about diet. Why should we have to diet to be acne-free? Isn't that a problem in itself too? If there are other human life forms that don't suffer from eating junk, then what about us? I don't eat junk, but I still suffer. If I have (or you have) an allergy to a certain food, aren't we just masking the problem by staying away from that substance? I really want to bare down and look into what is exactly seeping into our skin from the inside. It may not be simple, but it sure to be the cure.

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Tornado. I don't think that it's the blood. I have met people in the past that have Jaundice and I've been researching the topic because it's all about the liver and how it isn't able to handle all of the toxic input. I haven't seen any of them with acne. I do think that it has to do with the oils being secreted that are mixed with fatty acids that haven't been completely broken down. This, I believe, is the fault of the liver.

Tell me more about why you believe the dirty blood to be at fault.

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What kind of baffles me is how accutane can eliminate acne. What does accutane do to the blood or at least deliver through the blood to the pores to stop sebum?
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I did not know that this stuff is DNA altering.

Shortly after completing my accutane treatment I got digestive problems and started passing gas non stop, it was so bad it was embarrising to go to class and my doc back then had no idea, so he said it was all phsychological.

I changed my diet, ate no sugar etc, which helped limit the gas prodution, but I still passed gas on a daily basis from 2003 to 2007. Now I am eating gluten free and my gas porblem has vanished and my digestion problems are gone too.

I always knew that Accutane had messed up my system, mainly the digstive system, which is the foundation to a healthy body. But for some time know I had the suspicion that Accutane caused my gluten intolerance.

I guess I have to do more research...

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Yeah, I've heard these kind of reports about accutane before. Luckily I had to stop my usage before anything could get out of hand, but it seems that the drug is just too fickle in regards to side effects. I'm sure that even the individual who thinks they got off clean from a treatment will find that to be not true later on in life. It's really a sad thing that the drug works so well, so many will suffer. Anything that mixes up our chemical processes so severely is obviously something to avoid.

I keep reading that this is a last resort decision for docs today... that wasn't the case with mine. He wanted me on it immediately after BP (alone) did not work.

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What kind of baffles me is how accutane can eliminate acne. What does accutane do to the blood or at least deliver through the blood to the pores to stop sebum?
Accutane counters acne by reducing the production of sebum and shrinking the sebaceous glands. This directly stops or slows down the amount of pimples forming. It is said that Accutane works by altering DNA transcription which ultimately lowers the amount and severity of acne.
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Thanks for the Accutane info, Notadoctor. I had been wondering about DNA transcription for a while.

Personally I think I have abnormal keratinisation genetically and that diet is small factor in the whole acne equation for me.

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Thanks for the Accutane info, Notadoctor. I had been wondering about DNA transcription for a while.

Personally I think I have abnormal keratinisation genetically and that diet is small factor in the whole acne equation for me.

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