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(sorry for my English). I have been to one of the best plastic doctors in my country today. he did not encourage me at all. as a mater a fact, he said that only thing he could do for my scars is: a) dermoabrasion and b)chemical peeling...there is NO c) solution. I have rolling scars (very shallow as he said, but I don't agree off course because this problem is bigger to me than to him) and he was very honest with me. he sad that he would not recommend dermoabrasion because of its side effects and very very minor changes. he showed me some pictures of patients on which he performed dermoabrasion (with ice pick scars) and I was not satisfied with results... he agreed with me that changes were minor after operation. he suggested chemical peel (with 30% tca, cost 300 €, only one treatment.you can do next treatment in about a year but I am not sure about this).chemical peels are ok he said, but this is not a solution for my problem.not even close. after this, my skin will only look healthier, nothing else (N O T H I N G).I mention microdermoabrasion....he did not laugh, but he almost did...after several microdermoabrasion you would look like someone slap you 10 times in the face, he said. it does not help at all.. when I asked him about those before and after photos you can find on the web, he only laughed....he said that there is very big manipulation with these photos. when I got home I tried to manipulate with these photos myself. I put one photo in acdsee and with only one push to one button, you can not believe what you can do....try it for your self. a little baby could do it. also, he mentioned, just for example, that those laser treatments for removal of hair are ridiculous. they put before photo, shave the guy, and then take another picture, and that is it.

before that doctore, I visited one other doctor and she started to tell me fray tails about the improvement that we would achieve...but I did not trust her for a second. She was trying to avoid to look me in the eyes while talking to me. I knew she was laying.

I know that that would be a big disappointment for a lot of you but this is the truth. I totally agree with the guy that send one post before (I forgot his nick) in which he said totally the same story…in that time I didn’t wanted to believe in that (as I am sure that many of you would react the same way after my post) but now I know that is 100% true.

Plastic surgery can help you in many other cases .he showed me pictures of nose operation, chin etc. it looks great. Those people can start a new life. They look much prettier. But for this….big NO.

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hi there firstpost your post made me laugh biggrin.gif

I think all of us here know scars are very hard to treat.. but we're not giving up. And I bet if you read through more threads, like TCA cross, smoothbeam, needling etc, you will change your mind about giving up too! Derms don't know everything..

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I agree with Sally firstpost - most derms and plastic surgeons have a limited knowledge about all the different scar revision techniques - spend a few days reading all the threads (and start with the FAQ: http://acne.org/messageboard/viewtopic.php?t=5996) - Younwill find that there IS a solution to everything - maybe we can't always aim for 100% - but most people here will find that given enough time and the right techniques, we can have 70-80% improvement.

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well what can I say sally. I did not wanted to disappointed anybody but I trust my doctor because I know he is up-to-date with all new technologies and possibilities of modern medicine. when you, or anybody else show me example which shows improvement I will change my mind ([email protected] is the adress) and say I AM SORRY. not pictures from the web because I tried to manipulate with them and it is so fuckin easy. click edit and one of the buttons (I forgott which) that will smoth your face and you would look like a baby and so clean and real.

some of the doctors are prepare to convince you that some method is very efficient.a mention hair treatment with laser in my previous post because it is the best example of what is the medicine industry capable to do to make money. every doctor that has that laser will advertise himself on the web and anywhere else and will try to assure you that that thing works...that thing does not work. from that example you can see how they work. I had luck, that I met doctor that would not tell me fray tails and take my money for nothing.

don't you think that he heard about methods you mention too?

but, as I already said, I would like to see some examples....from first hand....not just words....

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I actually tried laser for hair removal.. and it worked.. not 100% , maybe 60-70% , and if I do it a few more times it will be closer to 80, 90%. Same for scar removal, you can improve it bit by bit.

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look how many people visits this site....don't you find it strange that not one of them showed results. not a bit...or I didn't saw them (I am sorry if that is the case).I know that sending your picture on the web is a little embarecing...maybe that is the reason...but no one wrighted about it also.

if you had some pics with improvment I would be greatful if you send them...sorry, but I only belive hard evidence.....not just bla, bla....

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it is your choice not to believe that progress can be made. I believe everyone here on this board is here because they believe progress can be made, even if it takes time and after several rounds of trial and error. Many of us have made small progresses in some form or another, I myself have used some of the higher-percentage glycolics with very little (but still noticeable) success. With some of the other products, I've also seen a general improvement in skin tone for which I'm grateful for. If you read the smoothbeam thread, you will see that there have been results ranging from minimal to those who are very happy. If nothing else, there is a lot to be learned here and a lot of support.

I do not understand why you are making ultimatums asking for pictures to prove you anything. No one's selling you anything here, no one has to prove anything with hard evidence for your benefit. Your tone seems accusatory which I don't appreciate. The truth of the matter is everyone is here because they have hope that some improvement can be made. If you don't have that within yourself, then I'm not sure anyone can prove you otherwise, even with pictures. You will just say there are lighting discrepencies, etc.

I hope you will join all of us in our slow but steady search towards any improvement. But please don't stand at the foot of the door, blocking other people, and accuse us of not giving you hard evidence of our improvement. Nobody here is required to do anything for you, but everyone here is willing to help. So take what you want of it.

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far from it jackthebear. I am not accusing anybody. I am just telling my story to prevent that someone else run into a trap like I did in some other cases. Many people discourage themselves trying all kind of methods and after that do not write posts to share there experiences.

If I was talking to a relevant doctor (quoted many times in my country) and I didn't see ANY progress with my own eyes from other people (and I was seeking and seeking and seeking and seeking.....), neither was my doctor or anybody else what conclusion should I (or anyone else) make?

for the time being, there is no solution that would make relevant changes and that would be satisfactory. you should visit official web pages of doctor organizations and see what progress is possible whit each method...when you listen some doctor that has a private practise and read "documents" from his web page you get a wrong picture of the situation. I am sure that on official web pages of doctor organizations (or how is it called) that many of mention doctors would be there but on a "black list".

if it is easier for you to share you experiences with no improvement at all that's legitimate. this forum is very useful (I was seeking on the web exactly something like this.to see experiences from other ordinary people, not doctors, is there a solution) but I think that we have gone to different conclusions.

from this forum I concluded exactly what I said in the first post and some of you are concluded something else. as I said that is legitimate.

quote:

"I do not understand why you are making ultimatums asking for pictures to prove you anything. No one's selling you anything here, no one has to prove anything with hard evidence for your benefit. Your tone seems accusatory which I don't appreciate. The truth of the matter is . If you don't have that within yourself, then I'm not sure anyone can prove you otherwise, even with pictures. You will just say there are lighting discrepencies, etc. "

I am not making ultimatums. it is just that this is not praying to god (regarding "everyone is here because they have hope that some improvement can be made") . medicine knows exactly what is possible and what is not possible. sorry, but I am a scientist my self and I believe in evidence. I did not mean to provoke someone to gave me an evidence. if there is evidence someone would already show it, believe me.

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I can understand your current mentality. Sometimes I felt the same way as if I am doomed. However, I still argue that things are not so pessimistic and improvement is absolutely possible. I did a skin graft surgery a month ago and I definitely see improvements at least 30%-40%. There was one hold on my forehead, now it is completely gone. My temples look much smoother than before, esp if you see them from the side. Some scars on the cheeks are less noticeable too. some shallow and small ones are hardly visible. The deep ones are still there, probably needing a redo. The doctor honest told me it is impossible to correct every scar, but such improvement already makes me think that life could be better and better as long as we don't give up easily. (I used to think my acne will stay forever, as it was horrible. But they were completely gone within 3 months due to the correct medicine I took). I don't have a digital camera, so I can't prove it. But there is no reason I should lie here, right?

It is bad already that we physically scarred on the face. It will be worse if we are psychologically scarred in the heart.

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Several laser treatments or whatever of a spread out period of time is great if you're a person ready to spend hundreds to thousands of dollars on low percentage improvements, but what if you're a person without this kind of scratch to spend on facial surgery. I guess you could say that those people might as well give up. And I am one of those people with scars, but I can't afford to spend that kind of money for that.

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firstpost,

perhaps it is that english is not your native language that i am misconstruing your words into something not there. In any case, I think people here are realistic that they aren't looking for 100%. Granted, everyone wants that, and when we don't have that we're still looking for more, but, in my opinion anyway, any little bit helps. I know that my scar definitely looks better today than it did a year ago even if only slightly. But: If it has gotten even slightly better now than it was last year, then how do i know more progress can't be made? I'm sorry I don't have pictures and you don't have to believe me because i don't have hard proof, but i've looked intensely at my skin multiple times a day for the past few years, so I'm sure I see something.

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First Post: You are partially correct in that nothing will completely get rid of scars; however, it IS possible to see SOME improvement, and that's better than anything to some. Your Dr. was honest with you, and didn't mislead you into thinking you could achieve miraculous results which shows ethics on his part. You said he mentioned TCA peel--I have seen some medical articles on that procedure, and it is very serious--you need to be hooked up to an EKG during the procedure, so definately research it if you're going to do it. I must admit, I didn't do extensive research on TCA peels, so I am no expert on it.

I feel like you do at times; although, I think scars can get better over many years. I have three or four chicken pox scars that were very deep, and now, they are flush with the skin. I don't know how that happened, but it did take MANY years. Also, I have another scar from an injury, and it is also now flush with the skin, and it's not nearly as old as the pox scars. Maybe it is bc it's on my hand/arm? I do not know, but they are virtually gone. Additionally, a woman I used to work with started using retin-a and glycolic cream, and her scars are basically gone. She says she did nothing else, but "peeled like crazy"(her words).

Everyones's skin/ scars are different, and everyone heals differently. You are right to be skeptical, but something might work for you if you try.

~Emma

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I think you're just looking for an easy answer but you know what there is no easy cure for scars.

You need to remember that everyone's body is different, my suggestion to you is educate yourself and try what you think will work for you. remember that it's going to take months for you to see results

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firstpost:

Just a few of my thoughts on your post:

- Though Dermabrasion can be effective for treating scars, it can also cause further scarring if the Dr. is not skilled in the use of the tools. If you decide to do this, you must choose a very skilled Physician.

- Some chemical peels are very shallow and some go very deep. Lactic Acid is an example of a shallow peel and Exoderm is an example of a chemical peel that goes very deep. I have heard several positive stories of Exoderm.

- For rolling scars (shallow), please do some research into "subcision" which is subcutaneous incisionless surgery. There are a couple of threads here, one of which has before and after photos with some improvements. If your scars are shallow, then you can also look into SmoothBeam non-ablative laser which has been FDA approved for acne scarring.

- 100% TCA spot treating is showing some promise, particularly for ice picks. Please look at the threads in this forum for more information. The threads will lead you to links for photographs.

- I agree that microdermabrasion does not go deep enough to make much, if any difference for moderate to severe scarring.

- I agree that in many cases, when selling a service is involved, that photographs may be manipulated. In some cases it is the angle of the face or the lighting.

In essence, keep searching for a treatment but know that nothing is 100% effective or 100% guaranteed. Each individual will obtain different results.

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I know that that would be a big disappointment for a lot of you but this is the truth. I totally agree with the guy that send one post before (I forgot his nick) in which he said totally the same story…in that time I didn’t wanted to believe in that (as I am sure that many of you would react the same way after my post) but now I know that is 100% true. 

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