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WishClean

Member Since 06 Nov 2011
Offline Last Active Today, 08:37 AM

Posts I've Made

In Topic: Foods That Mess Me Up

Today, 08:34 AM

Hey buddy, good luck with your diet adjustments. If I may, I would recommend ditching canned foods altogether. I know it's convenient to eat canned foods, but they contain more preservatives, and many people react to the preservatives in canned foods rather than the foods themselves. Even if some canned foods are ok, I would encourage you to try and ditch the cans altogether.

Also, if you don't want to get too paranoid about what you eat, I would recommend a few supplements to prevent big flare ups for when you do eat something that bothers you. I personally have been taking SOD enzymes to minimize my histamine reactions to foods, and I can relax a bit with my diet. Digestive enzymes can also work, especially if you suspect lactose intolerance or gluten sensitivity.

In Topic: Hormone & Vitamin Tests

Yesterday, 05:34 PM

Just adding this to the mix - I need to do more research. HcG, human chorionic gonadotropin (hCG), has been linked to acne (mostly the artificial stuff). Perhaps elevated HcG levels could contribute to acne, and could also be the sign of a tumor.

In Topic: Inositol's Impact On Hormonal Acne

Yesterday, 05:15 PM


 

Yes, on second thought the other ingredients contained in Estrosense may not be wise to take at the moment. I will purchase DIM on its own and HOPEFULLY that combined with Inositol will help!!! Don't think I will be that lucky tho :P xx 

 

Keep me updated on your progress! give it some time :)


In Topic: Inositol's Impact On Hormonal Acne

Yesterday, 05:11 PM

 

 

 


Hi WishClean,

Thank you so much for your detailed response. Yes I have taken D3 for depression, I also take 5HTP which helps tremendously as well as L-Theanine. Since I've been taking Inositol I have actually found that my mood is much more stable and my anxiety is less pronounced. I also do mindfulness meditation and other mindfulness meditative practices which have been incredibly enlightening. 

You mentioned that my dose of Vitex may have been too high -- what is considered a mega/high dose compared to a smaller dose? 

Also, you said "Inositol does not balance the same hormones, though....it sounds like your main issues are estrogen & progesterone. Inositol will probably do nothing for balancing your estrogen levels so you will need to combine it with something else" --  I was under the impression that your imbalance was also estrogen/progesterone related, which is why Inositol worked well for you, is that not the case?  I suspect I have low progesterone and high estrogen since Vitex worked so beautifully for me (as it did for you!) -- I read that Inositol helps increase progesterone which is why women with PCOS have success while on it, and which is why it also benefits fertility. Vitex also promotes progesterone but through pituitary gland activation. So technically Inositol should help, am I right?

I'm debating whether or not to give Vitex another try at a smaller dose as you suggested. I'm just so worried that it might induce depression, it took me ages to feel good again and I kept getting increased anxiety during PMS which I never had, it took many cycles for that to smooth over... but maybe I'll be lucky at a smaller dose. Perhaps I should just start with adding some DIM to Inositol (1/8 tsp twice a day - as per your suggestion) and see if that makes a difference....and leave Vitex as a last resort?

Emma xx



 


If inositol is helping you in other ways besides acne, that's still good. It is used for anxiety, ADHD, OCD and other issues, so it could definitely help but keep the dose conservative. I read that a few people with ADHD (or could be OCD, can't remember now) who took a very high dose (the therapeutic dose, which is much higher for those conditions than for acne) actually had manic incidents...which is why I think that anything in excess can backfire.

My imbalance is complex, that's why it took me a lot of research & trial and error to figure the basic things out. My progesterone is low, and I (used to?) have high estrogen (one sign is that I tend to put on weight in my mid-section, and another sign is melasma). But I also have symptoms of high androgens, such as some facial hair (now much more manageable) & excess body hair (thank you laser for getting rid of it!). As I mentioned before, I took vitex the first time for much longer than I was advised...I was told to take the full dose for 6 months, then reduce it and gradually wean off. Since I was using a tincture, I was taking I think around 26-30 drops per day (if I remember correctly), and I'm not sure how much it amounts to in capsule mg. I would probably never take vitex capsules anyway, since I was getting an original vitex  tincture from a naturopath in Europe, and it seemed of a higher quality than processed stuff because he was getting it straight from the source (the tree, that grows in parts of Europe/ Mediterranean).

Anyway, after about 7-8 months on vitex, I was still afraid to reduce the dose since my skin was healthy & glowing (I also credit evening primrose oil for the glow). But I did notice more chin & neck hairs sprouting, and that's how I suspected that there was something off with my androgens. It seems that vitex fixed some hormones, but threw my androgens (or perhaps indirectly, through prolactin levels or the pituitary gland) off balance. Or, it lowered my progesterone even more, since I read that increased facial hair could also be a sign of low progesterone. Either way, the second time I went on it, it did keep the acne at bay but I did not have as spectacular results as the first time. I also had increased sensitivities & high histamine reactions to things, so I stopped all herbs while sorting out that issue. And the third time I took it, I developed a rash-like reaction within the first 2 weeks so I stopped it completely and haven't touched it since. My body was reacting to a lot of things during that time, though, but it seemed that my flare ups got worse 2 weeks into vitex so I stopped it and swapped it with DIM.

My facial hair responded well to inositol, and I think even to DIM a little bit, so I knew I was on the right track.

The truth is, noone really knows exactly how vitex works. Why? Because there are no funded long-term & high sample experiments, although I believe there should be. There are so many reviews online, yet so little research. Inositol, on the other hand, has more research behind it (including doctor recommended products) and fewer reviews/ actual user experiences. I still do not fully understand the mechanism of vitex, and I don't think anyone accurately does. I think women react differently to it, depending on individual body chemistry, and it can be quite unpredictable. Even the person who recommended it to me was baffled by the increase in facial hair and could not offer a scientific explanation for it. So yeah, I would leave it as a last resort since out of all your options, it is the one least suitable for long term use. Of course, there are women (esp. on soul cysters) who take vitex for years without negative side effects, but based on my experience with it, I would only recommend it when all else fails. Keep using the inositol, and if you feel like you need to, add a low dose of DIM and monitor your reaction daily. Also, it wouldn't hurt to up your vitamin C, either through diet or an acid-free supplement.

FYI: I usually turn to examine.com if I need an overview of the research that's out there for particular herbs & supplements. They usually include exceptions to how something acts, and also mention interactions. The page on vitex is interesting. http://examine.com/s...x agnus castus/



 


Thank you, WishClean. That is all extremely helpful. I will stick with the inositol and stay at this lower dose -- my body is very sensitive to vitamins/supplements so i will definitely not be taking large doses of it. 1/4 tsp daily will hopefully be enough. I will add some DIM to inositol and see how that works. I have a bottle of Estrosense/Estrosmart at home which contains 50mg of DIM per capsule -- perhaps I will start with one capsule a day and increase to 2 capsules after a few weeks. 

Do you recall wen you noticed the Inositol started working? What about DIM? 

Many thanks xx


Estrosense has a bunch of other ingredients, though, so if I were you I would take just DIM on its own to see if it is working. Indole-3-Carbinol, contained in Estrosense, is a bit controversial and I'm not sure it's the right form to take if you have hormonal sensitivities.
The DIM I have is 100mg, but I used to take half a capsule twice a day (so 100 total, but split into 2) along with vitamin C for better absorption. Some have success if they combine it with calcium d glucarate, but I didn't. Now if I feel like I need DIM, I just take around 25mg for a couple of days as maintenance and sometimes add a bit of evening primrose oil with it.

Inositol started working a bit within the first week, but I didn't see a dramatic improvement until about 3 weeks- 1 month into it. DIM started working within the first week, but I think it was also because inositol helped keep the acne at bay. DIM just kind of sealed the deal. On top of that, though, I was taking digestive enzymes because I still got breakouts from certain foods & products. But that type of acne was not hormonal/ cystic, it looked different, so I had to do something else for that.
 



EDIT: From examine.com's page on DIM (also read this in other sources):

"In small amounts, it can both inhibit the aromatase enzyme (and prevent conversion of testosterone into estrogen) and it can act on more potent forms of estrogen and convert them into less potent forms; this conversion reduces the overall effects of estrogen in the body. However, taking too much DIM at once can actually induce the aromatase enzyme and act in the opposite manner and increase estrogen synthesis." --> so it's all about finding the right dose and not overdoing it. I would say start low, definitely!

In Topic: Inositol's Impact On Hormonal Acne

Yesterday, 04:40 PM

 


Hi WishClean,

Thank you so much for your detailed response. Yes I have taken D3 for depression, I also take 5HTP which helps tremendously as well as L-Theanine. Since I've been taking Inositol I have actually found that my mood is much more stable and my anxiety is less pronounced. I also do mindfulness meditation and other mindfulness meditative practices which have been incredibly enlightening. 

You mentioned that my dose of Vitex may have been too high -- what is considered a mega/high dose compared to a smaller dose? 

Also, you said "Inositol does not balance the same hormones, though....it sounds like your main issues are estrogen & progesterone. Inositol will probably do nothing for balancing your estrogen levels so you will need to combine it with something else" --  I was under the impression that your imbalance was also estrogen/progesterone related, which is why Inositol worked well for you, is that not the case?  I suspect I have low progesterone and high estrogen since Vitex worked so beautifully for me (as it did for you!) -- I read that Inositol helps increase progesterone which is why women with PCOS have success while on it, and which is why it also benefits fertility. Vitex also promotes progesterone but through pituitary gland activation. So technically Inositol should help, am I right?

I'm debating whether or not to give Vitex another try at a smaller dose as you suggested. I'm just so worried that it might induce depression, it took me ages to feel good again and I kept getting increased anxiety during PMS which I never had, it took many cycles for that to smooth over... but maybe I'll be lucky at a smaller dose. Perhaps I should just start with adding some DIM to Inositol (1/8 tsp twice a day - as per your suggestion) and see if that makes a difference....and leave Vitex as a last resort?

Emma xx



 


If inositol is helping you in other ways besides acne, that's still good. It is used for anxiety, ADHD, OCD and other issues, so it could definitely help but keep the dose conservative. I read that a few people with ADHD (or could be OCD, can't remember now) who took a very high dose (the therapeutic dose, which is much higher for those conditions than for acne) actually had manic incidents...which is why I think that anything in excess can backfire.

My imbalance is complex, that's why it took me a lot of research & trial and error to figure the basic things out. My progesterone is low, and I (used to?) have high estrogen (one sign is that I tend to put on weight in my mid-section, and another sign is melasma). But I also have symptoms of high androgens, such as some facial hair (now much more manageable) & excess body hair (thank you laser for getting rid of it!). As I mentioned before, I took vitex the first time for much longer than I was advised...I was told to take the full dose for 6 months, then reduce it and gradually wean off. Since I was using a tincture, I was taking I think around 26-30 drops per day (if I remember correctly), and I'm not sure how much it amounts to in capsule mg. I would probably never take vitex capsules anyway, since I was getting an original vitex  tincture from a naturopath in Europe, and it seemed of a higher quality than processed stuff because he was getting it straight from the source (the tree, that grows in parts of Europe/ Mediterranean).

Anyway, after about 7-8 months on vitex, I was still afraid to reduce the dose since my skin was healthy & glowing (I also credit evening primrose oil for the glow). But I did notice more chin & neck hairs sprouting, and that's how I suspected that there was something off with my androgens. It seems that vitex fixed some hormones, but threw my androgens (or perhaps indirectly, through prolactin levels or the pituitary gland) off balance. Or, it lowered my progesterone even more, since I read that increased facial hair could also be a sign of low progesterone. Either way, the second time I went on it, it did keep the acne at bay but I did not have as spectacular results as the first time. I also had increased sensitivities & high histamine reactions to things, so I stopped all herbs while sorting out that issue. And the third time I took it, I developed a rash-like reaction within the first 2 weeks so I stopped it completely and haven't touched it since. My body was reacting to a lot of things during that time, though, but it seemed that my flare ups got worse 2 weeks into vitex so I stopped it and swapped it with DIM.

My facial hair responded well to inositol, and I think even to DIM a little bit, so I knew I was on the right track.

The truth is, noone really knows exactly how vitex works. Why? Because there are no funded long-term & high sample experiments, although I believe there should be. There are so many reviews online, yet so little research. Inositol, on the other hand, has more research behind it (including doctor recommended products) and fewer reviews/ actual user experiences. I still do not fully understand the mechanism of vitex, and I don't think anyone accurately does. I think women react differently to it, depending on individual body chemistry, and it can be quite unpredictable. Even the person who recommended it to me was baffled by the increase in facial hair and could not offer a scientific explanation for it. So yeah, I would leave it as a last resort since out of all your options, it is the one least suitable for long term use. Of course, there are women (esp. on soul cysters) who take vitex for years without negative side effects, but based on my experience with it, I would only recommend it when all else fails. Keep using the inositol, and if you feel like you need to, add a low dose of DIM and monitor your reaction daily. Also, it wouldn't hurt to up your vitamin C, either through diet or an acid-free supplement.

FYI: I usually turn to examine.com if I need an overview of the research that's out there for particular herbs & supplements. They usually include exceptions to how something acts, and also mention interactions. The page on vitex is interesting. http://examine.com/s...m, for example:
 

"It is primarily used today to alleviate the symptoms of premenstrual syndrome. Vitex agnus-castus has outperformed placebo in numerous trials, and has been shown to be effective at reducing hot flashes, bloating, irritability, sleep disturbances, depressions, various mood disorders and even cramping associated with premenstrual syndrome.


Though animal evidence suggests that taking Vitex agnus-castus may increase estrogen and progesterone levels, further research is needed to confirm this effect. Vitex agnus-castus has limited use outside of its effects on premenstrual syndrome.

Vitex agnus-castus acts similarly to dopamine, by reducing prolactin levels, which are elevated during premenstrual syndrome. It may also act on the opioid system by releasing beta-endorphins, something the human body lacks during premenstrual syndrome."

--> This seems to point to vitex's positive impact on PMS and depression, but you had a different experience. I think it could be due to, as I mentioned, the dosage, and/or the fact that in your case, you may have only needed it right before your period/ during PMS. I noticed this whenever I took evening primrose..it helps me more before ovulation and before my period, otherwise I feel bloated and a bit moody. Timing these things takes patience and careful tracking, though....anyway, just another thing to think about...