Jump to content

Photo

Self Subcision


25 replies to this topic

#1 1weektohappiness

1weektohappiness

    New Member

  • Members
  • Posts & Likes
    Posts: 11
    Likes: 0
About Me
  • Joined: 07-August 09

Posted 23 March 2013 - 01:31 PM

After my dermatologist wouldn't do subcision I decided to do it myself. Iv'e done it a few times now and have seen slight improvement but not nearly as much as I wanted. I'm just wondering if I might be doing it wrong?

 

Where do insert the needle? At the edge of the scar or slightly beyond it? And when I do the fanning motion do I stay underneath scar or go slightly beyond it? Basically do I puncture the wall of the scar where it meets the healthy skin?

 

Anything else that I might be doing wrong?

 

Also how often should I do it?


Edited by 1weektohappiness, 23 March 2013 - 01:32 PM.


#2 DamnLife

DamnLife

    The Great One

  • Veteran Members
  • Posts & Likes
    Posts: 172
    Likes: 19
About Me
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Lithuania
  • Joined: 16-February 13

Posted 23 March 2013 - 03:03 PM

You should find another derm and do it now before hurting and scarring yourself even more.



#3 panos

panos

    Member

  • Veteran Members
  • Posts & Likes
    Posts: 417
    Likes: 61
About Me
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:athens
  • Interests:Regenerating from the Core
  • Joined: 26-December 12

Posted 23 March 2013 - 03:09 PM

if you use really small lancets,there is nothing wrong to be afraid...

just make sure to keep intervals like 3-4 weeks between



#4 1weektohappiness

1weektohappiness

    New Member

  • Members
  • Posts & Likes
    Posts: 11
    Likes: 0
About Me
  • Joined: 07-August 09

Posted 23 March 2013 - 04:25 PM

I've already done it a few times and haven't had any additional scaring as it is quite easy to do. But i've only seen like 15% improvement.



#5 tricia

tricia

    Veteran Member

  • Veteran Members
  • Posts & Likes
    Posts: 1,278
    Likes: 22
About Me
  • Gender:Female
  • Joined: 23-February 04

Posted 24 March 2013 - 07:32 PM

what needle have you been using?  I only had minimal improvement as well when I did self subcision with diabetic syringes.  Maybe the 18 gauge nokor needle is needed to really see true improvement.  That would take a bit more guts to do yourself and would probably require professional numbing, which I never bother with.



#6 Miko Yan

Miko Yan

    New Member

  • Members
  • Posts & Likes
    Posts: 18
    Likes: 6
About Me
  • Joined: 16-September 12

Posted 25 March 2013 - 01:35 AM

ive been wondering that too, are thin needles really more safe/effective than thicker ones? because it appears that subcision done professionally is only performed with really thick needles (indeed around 18g). And the guy who got massive improvement (judging by his pictures) used plain sewing needles, which are considerably thicker than diabetic lancets.

 

i have to say i tried with the thinnest sewing needle i could find and it was very hard and painful to pierce the skin horizontally. i cant even imagine the pain with even thicker needles..



#7 austra

austra

    Member

  • Veteran Members
  • Posts & Likes
    Posts: 545
    Likes: 58
About Me
  • Joined: 17-July 11

Posted 25 March 2013 - 03:15 AM

Is subcision effective on shallow rolling scars? I just yesterday noticed I actually do have a couple of rolling scars, or depressions/dents on skin, but they only show up in certain lighting and have managed to escape my attention thus far (one of them is from a recent cyst that is still hyperpigmented, which why I noticed that one in the first place). I hope it means that others don't really see them either.

 

I'd like to consider subcision on them at some point, but since they're so shallow, I don't know if it would really help. I wouldn't dare try it on my own though. I'd imagine a nokor needle is necessary to get the best results, and it seems risky to do it on your own and could lead to additional scarring if you don't know what you're doing. Not to mention the risk of infection, you can't really emulate a sterile surgical environment at home. It seems riskier to me than at-home dermarolling or lancet needling where I can't imagine accidentally slipping and causing big trauma to your skin, but you can basically only create the kind of micro wounds you are supposed to.

 

So well, if you do this at home, please be very careful and watch lots of videos beforehand and try to be as gentle as possible and sterile. It would be best to go to a professional though.


Edited by austra, 25 March 2013 - 03:23 AM.


#8 tricia

tricia

    Veteran Member

  • Veteran Members
  • Posts & Likes
    Posts: 1,278
    Likes: 22
About Me
  • Gender:Female
  • Joined: 23-February 04

Posted 25 March 2013 - 09:40 AM

If you are going to use a bigger needle the safest thing to do is stay fairly shallow and horizontal, not vertical.   If you go vertical you will risk further scarring.  You can order a nokor needle online and it comes sterile.  I don't think sewing needles would be great because they're probably not that sharp which would cause more pain when you insert it. It would cause a more messy entry point as well.  Lancets don't work well for me, I've tried them, the 30 gauge needles are better, because they are longer and you can do the fanning motion under the scar.  Maybe if you got filler right after this it would help to keep them from reattaching.  Smaller scars won't require the bigger needles. 



#9 austra

austra

    Member

  • Veteran Members
  • Posts & Likes
    Posts: 545
    Likes: 58
About Me
  • Joined: 17-July 11

Posted 25 March 2013 - 11:11 AM

Just found this video in an older subcision thread. It does give you a rough idea on how subcision is performed.

 

http://www.youtube.c...d&v=DUvnAqhUjaQ

 

A few remarks 

1) There are large veins and important nerves in the face, and if you're not trained medically and don't know to look out for these, you could end up causing yourself a lot of damage in the worst case scenario. That's why I don't like the idea of anyone trying this on their own. Since dermarolling and needling use very short needles, they have much less risk.

2) I can't help but think that it would be so easy to accidentally punch the nokor needle through the skin and cause a big wound which would scar. I don't know how big a risk this is in practice.

3) It seems very hard/impossible to do this effectively on yourself in some areas, like the forehead.

4) You can see that subcision is performed in a surgical environment, using sterile gloves, a sterile needle, sterile everything. It is important to prevent infections, and one should be extremely careful about hygiene with any sort of home treatments, use sterile gloves, disinfect everything beforehand, use a sterile needle etc. And sterile does not mean wiping a needle quickly with disinfectant before getting started.



#10 panos

panos

    Member

  • Veteran Members
  • Posts & Likes
    Posts: 417
    Likes: 61
About Me
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:athens
  • Interests:Regenerating from the Core
  • Joined: 26-December 12

Posted 25 March 2013 - 11:40 AM

^Dont scare people.

 

Using diabetic lancet 33g,

disinfecting with alcohol both the needle and the area,

doing only 4 small incisions 

waiting and repeat after 1 month

stretching the skin up while subcising

 

wont cause any of what you wrote..

 

even though no need to wait for an inflammation producing system heal itself properly.



#11 mr. matt

mr. matt

    Member

  • Veteran Members
  • Posts & Likes
    Posts: 403
    Gallery Images: 68
    Blog Entries: 64
    Likes: 56
About Me
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:United States
  • Joined: 12-November 06

Posted 25 March 2013 - 11:40 AM

Austra: I agree with you completely. Any type of invasive procedure should be done by a trained professional such as a dermatologist or plasti surgeon if it involves the face. The risks of self-injury are too high to perform this on yourself. It's worth the money to have a trained professional to do this. Why risk further scarring, infection, nerve damage by doing it yourself. During my first subcision treatment, my doctor told me that the Nokor needle was bowing due to the dense fibrous tissue tethering my epidermis down. Can you imagine what would happen if a needle broke under your skin while performing subcision at home yourself? A surgeon would have to open up your face to retrieve the needle. It's not worth the risk in my opinion. Matt

#12 1weektohappiness

1weektohappiness

    New Member

  • Members
  • Posts & Likes
    Posts: 11
    Likes: 0
About Me
  • Joined: 07-August 09

Posted 25 March 2013 - 10:33 PM

Luckily I already had some-kind of nokar needle (triangular point). I tried with a sewing needle but I could hardly grip it none the less puncture my skin with it. First I disinfect everything. Then I do three puncture spots around the scar ( It hurts but so does shitty scarred skin) while stretching the skin (should I pinch it up instead?). I move around horizontally to break up the fibrotic strands (the scar is pretty big but I don't hear or feel too many breaking). I also stretch the skin upwards to initiate healing. I've done this four times and each time the scar swells up even with the rest of the skin for about a week then starts going back down. I'm positive that it's helped as the scar does seem shallower but it hasn't shrunk horizontally like I hoped. I'm going to continue this until its healed or not helping anymore as it's really the only option.

 

I decided to do it after I saw this thread http://www.acne.org/...y-bad-and-ugly/. I wish he would give more details.

 

PS I asked my dermatologist to it but he wouldn't.


Edited by 1weektohappiness, 25 March 2013 - 10:36 PM.


#13 panos

panos

    Member

  • Veteran Members
  • Posts & Likes
    Posts: 417
    Likes: 61
About Me
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:athens
  • Interests:Regenerating from the Core
  • Joined: 26-December 12

Posted 26 March 2013 - 05:19 AM

I am a firm believer that whatever we do for scars wont have the results we like,if we dont kill all the pathogens first ,being inside of our bodies...

We need to do the hard work both subcision,and regeneration from inside....Why do i  tell you this?

Well i just saw how the scar have filled in today after applying iodine in other areas(but iodine went systemically into the blood and i could feel tingling sensations)..

I have subcised this scar like 2 weeks ago but still the healing i saw today cant be from subcision alone.

We need to stop our system hindering our regenerating potential..



#14 1weektohappiness

1weektohappiness

    New Member

  • Members
  • Posts & Likes
    Posts: 11
    Likes: 0
About Me
  • Joined: 07-August 09

Posted 26 March 2013 - 08:31 AM

Panos, I read that link you posted in another thread and that looks very interesting. Do you have any pics of your progress?



#15 panos

panos

    Member

  • Veteran Members
  • Posts & Likes
    Posts: 417
    Likes: 61
About Me
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:athens
  • Interests:Regenerating from the Core
  • Joined: 26-December 12

Posted 26 March 2013 - 10:25 AM

Nah i dont take any pictures,not even have  a camera..I am too much into life to want to prove anything.

I am just in a forum that has value by people posting their own experience.Trust me it works.(slowly)..

And i watch myself pretty much closely,so any result is easy too see.

 

Check the last pics of mr Matt(under the description of the pic you can see a catalogue of what he's doing 

to give his body an optimal profile regeneration ability).

 

I am afraid people think its just the methods that are not that good(maybe its true partially)

but they forget how the body should be in an optimal healing rate and condition.

 

Its like raising the insulin after the gum and then eating many carbs and fat which hinders this sensitivity to insulin.



#16 Rob_X_22

Rob_X_22

    Member

  • Veteran Members
  • Posts & Likes
    Posts: 453
    Gallery Images: 3
    Likes: 48
About Me
  • Gender:Male
  • Joined: 18-January 05

Posted 27 March 2013 - 04:32 PM

hey matt i was watching a video on a 70 yo man that has amazing skin and he said your skin needs sunlight ..what are your thoughts on this?



#17 panos

panos

    Member

  • Veteran Members
  • Posts & Likes
    Posts: 417
    Likes: 61
About Me
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:athens
  • Interests:Regenerating from the Core
  • Joined: 26-December 12

Posted 31 March 2013 - 08:01 AM

i found out that using iodine after subcision seems to promote tissue growth and lessens the indentation.

 

If you cause the subdermal trauma and you put iodine,your skin will soak it up and will target the subdermal injury.

That will eliminate any chance of scarring from subcision thus promoting real results.



#18 smoothmove

smoothmove

    Member

  • Veteran Members
  • Posts & Likes
    Posts: 125
    Likes: 0
About Me
  • Joined: 15-September 09

Posted 01 April 2013 - 01:30 AM

Hey Panos,

 

how soon after subcision did you start applying the iodine?



#19 panos

panos

    Member

  • Veteran Members
  • Posts & Likes
    Posts: 417
    Likes: 61
About Me
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:athens
  • Interests:Regenerating from the Core
  • Joined: 26-December 12

Posted 01 April 2013 - 04:38 PM

Hey Panos,

 

how soon after subcision did you start applying the iodine?

 

immediatley after.

If it is like 2% concentration you can apply 3-4 times a day.



#20 austra

austra

    Member

  • Veteran Members
  • Posts & Likes
    Posts: 545
    Likes: 58
About Me
  • Joined: 17-July 11

Posted 18 June 2013 - 04:12 PM

ive been wondering that too, are thin needles really more safe/effective than thicker ones? because it appears that subcision done professionally is only performed with really thick needles (indeed around 18g). And the guy who got massive improvement (judging by his pictures) used plain sewing needles, which are considerably thicker than diabetic lancets.

 

i have to say i tried with the thinnest sewing needle i could find and it was very hard and painful to pierce the skin horizontally. i cant even imagine the pain with even thicker needles..

You should NOT use a sewing needle. They're not meant for this, so they're too blunt (hard to use + causes bigger wounds which can lead to scarring) and they're not sterile (could lead to infection --> worse scarring). You have to get sterile lancets or hypodermic needles if you try something like this at home, and you have to do lots of research beforehand and be very careful. No sewing needles.






0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users