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#21 Nope.avi

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    You wanna know how I got these scars?

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Posted 09 May 2012 - 12:54 PM

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Edited by Nope.avi, 08 August 2012 - 08:24 PM.


#22 SoontobeMD

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Posted 09 May 2012 - 03:17 PM

OK Doc what is the percent of complications compared to other surgeries? That site also has a nice section for snake oil remedies that you know don't work, and half of them are pushed on this site. I have said many times that Re:pair is not for everybody, but for those that can tolerate it nothing really compares. Do you know the science behind SCAAR FX? There is very little information available. If you look at my signature you will see that I have gone with the biggies in scar treatment and I also wasted my time with the dermaroller and copper peptides. I would prefer to refer people to sites like this for their information.

http://www.ncbi.nlm....les/PMC2921736/


Dudley,
Since there is obviously no study doing a direct comparison on the safety of each laser therapy compared with subcision, lets look at some of the FDA reports by patients with adverse reactions to FRAXEL laser variants alone. According to the FDA, these reported cases represent only approximately 1-2% of the total adverse reactions to laser treatment.
http://www.accessdat...uestTimeout=500

EDIT: Apparently I can't link directly to the cases so type "fraxel" under brand, and change the date to somewhere around "2000"

Further evidence can be found with a simple search on this site alone.
Based upon 186 reviews, Fraxel laser varients produced an overall rating of 2.9 with a 65.97% approval rate
http://www.acne.org/.../298/page1.html

On the other hand subcision produced an overall rating of 3.5 with an 81.82% approval rate
http://www.acne.org/...s/57/page1.html

While it is true that the fraxel laser review is giving reviews on not just fraxel repair, the laser you are supporting, the similar variable exists with subcision since not all surgeons are experienced at performing the procedure.

Since you have also stated that you are not knowlegable on the effectiveness of subcision, here is a study on how effective subcision can be since apparently we both like studies.
http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/20553364
"RESULTS:
Forty-six patients followed the protocol completely, had 60-90% improvement in depth and size of scars (significant improvement) with mean: 71.73%. 28.2% of them had '80% improvement or more' (excellent improvement)."

I have yet to see a study on fraxel repair or any other laser for that matter provides an average of 70+% improvement after a single treatment. Of course, this would require the work of a very qualified surgeon to achieve.

Like I have stated, I am happy that you have found good results from your fraxel repair treatment, but people should be aware of the long list of risks associated with fraxel repair in addition to its potential benefits.

Edited by SoontobeMD, 09 May 2012 - 03:22 PM.


#23 DudleyDoRight

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Posted 09 May 2012 - 04:21 PM

Doc, see now that is a response that I can work with. Thanks. I doubt that many are getting 70% after one laser treatment, but data is very hard to come by, and subjective at that. I have even posted a very famous complication on my Laser-Link-O-Rama thread. http://www.realself....-laser-horrible I had no doubt that I could handle Re:pair because I have already had Dermabrasion and Regular CO2 in the past. I knew Re:pair was working because of 2 non-acne scars that were easy to track. I have no photos that show the extent of my scarring, that is why I refer to Danielle Osti. I will be going for a facelift later this year, I am just searching for the right Plastic Surgeon now. I thought I would quote a post from RealSelf.

"Hello all, When in Doubt, Tell the Truth. Mark Twain I was asked by a colleague to say a few words about the dialogue that has been going on here regarding Fraxel re:pair. Fraxel re:pair laser originally manufactured by Reliant, now Solta, is a very powerful fractional CO2 skin rejuvenative laser. I am a board certified Facial Plastic Surgeon since 1986, and have used original fully ablative CO2 lasers since they were first approved cosmetically in the early 1990’s. I have been using Fraxel re:store for 4 years, and Fraxel re:pair for 9 months, having treated nearly 100 patients with repair. I have said from the start that unfortunately we will see severe complications from Fraxel re:pair laser because it is so powerful of a tool, and it is not a commodity that you just buy and use, and wah-lah!, every patient looks years younger. It is a great tool for achieving those results, but not without knowledge, care, experience, willingness to seek help when needed, devotion to meticulous details, and a cosmetic physician’s combined scientific and artistic skills. My heart goes out to those patients such as Christine here on this site who have suffered complications from the treatment. Again, there will be more untoward events as more physicians use this incredible, and powerful technology. Fraxel re:pair works, and it works better than any other technology that I have been exposed to during my 25 years of facial cosmetic surgery experience. It works in the hands of some of the world’s top dermatologists who have endorsed Fraxel, including the brilliant inventor Rox Anderson,MD; Richard Fitzpatrick, MD; Ron Geronimus, MD; Chris Zachary, MD; ophthalmologist Howard Conn, MD, and facial plastic surgeon Steven Weiner, MD. These physicians are treating many patients every day with excellent results and very high safety profiles. Fraxel re:pair is the most clinically studied of all of the other fractionated CO2 lasers with the most peer reviewed articles in our scientific journals. Before being released to the public, and being FDA approved, Fraxel re:pair was studied for 2 ½ years by multiple investigators. Fraxel re:pair not only costs as much as a Lamborghini, but is as much of a precision instrument as the Italian car. All one needs to drive a Lamborghini is a driver’s license. All you need to use a fractionated laser (from any of the laser companies) is a doctor’s license. Just because you have a driver’s license and buy the Lamborghini does not mean that you drive off the new car lot and floor the gas pedal. That would cause a bad accident. The same is true for Fraxel re:pair. Just because a physician purchases the laser and it arrives in his office in the crate, does not equate to safe results without complications for his patients. The physician must be well trained in laser physics, the cosmetic use of lasers, and most importantly the conservative use of Fraxel re:pair particularly until he or she is familiar with their specific laser. When I first treated patients I was very conservative, and chose patients who would benefit from minimal improvement allowing for low treatment settings. At an early point, I realized that my patients were taking longer to heal, and were having “allergic” reactions to something. Even though they all eventually healed with excellent results, I contacted Reliant and asked that my laser be checked, concerned that something was off. The company immediately took care of the laser, and there have been no further problems. Fortunately I had a surgical and cosmetic laser background and experience, and knew that my new powerful laser needed a fine tuning. Most fortunately none of my patients have experienced burns, or permanent scarring or discoloration. All of these complications, plus more are possible. As with any surgical procedure, an informed consent between physician and patient must include all risks, complications, and alternative treatments. Once the benefits of the treatment far outweigh the risks, and the patient is willing to accept the small risk of a complication, then it is reasonable to proceed with the treatment. Pre- and post-treatment instructions need to be followed most carefully to insure optimum recovery. People need to have their hand held in the first week, which is very critical to their ultimate outcome. Early recognition of problems can reverse any long term issues in most cases. For patients who desire to look years younger with a single non-surgical in office procedure under local anesthetic, I believe that there is no better fractionated CO2 laser treatment than Fraxel re:pair. I will emphasize again, that I can only speak for myself and site my own patient results with this technology. I have spoken to dermatologists who have either sent their re:pair back or want to because it was too much of a “surgical-like” procedure to perform. Certainly an ability to use local nerve blocks and tumescent local anesthesia along with proper dosing of analgesics makes the procedure much more tolerable for both patient and physician. I fully agree with my colleague’s opinion above that physicians using Fraxel re:pair should have more of a “surgeon” philosophy regardless of their specialty training. I only agreed to treat patients with Fraxel re:pair after I researched the technology thoroughly, and visited the headquarters in Mountain View, California, and was personally convinced that when performed properly it was both safe, and effective. Thanks to our new President, “hope and change” are very popular right now in America. In facial cosmetic surgery as well we “hope” to “change” patients to achieve their specific aesthetic goals, in the safest and most effective manner. Like our country’s future, there are no absolute guarantees that there will not be complications and problems along the way. I hope and pray daily that the complications that we have heard about here resolve rapidly for the patients involved. Good luck and be well. Dr. P"
View answers from Michael A. Persky, MD


I have said many times that I know nothing about subcision, and that is why I never criticize it. I even posted a compliment to Tom_Mason on his improvement.


Nope, I used the most intense Copper Peptide Super COP from Skin biology per Loren Pickart PhD. here is a link to their forums. http://healthyskin.i...rm/f/7270023352 WOW, my last thread there was started Nov 22, 2008. My last post was on Oct 14, 2010. As you can see I gave up on Copper Peptides a long time ago. My handle is Dazed on there.

Edited by DudleyDoRight, 09 May 2012 - 05:28 PM.

Dermabrasion - Full Face

CO2 Full Face 1996

Fraxel Re:pair 70 mj - 60% May 22, 2008

Fraxel Re:pair 70 mj - 60% Jan 08, 2009

Fraxel Re:pair 70 mj - 60% Oct 30,2009

Fraxel Re:pair 70 mj - 60% Oct 08,2010

Fraxel Re:pair 70 mj - 60% Nov 04,2011

"The Road To Wellville" 1994
Goodloe Bender: Health! The 'open sesame' to the sucker's purse!

#24 Nope.avi

Nope.avi

    You wanna know how I got these scars?

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Posted 09 May 2012 - 07:37 PM

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Edited by Nope.avi, 08 August 2012 - 08:24 PM.


#25 DudleyDoRight

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 08:14 PM

Doc, I just reread your post and setting the date earlier than 2008 would give me a fase representation of the figures since I am not a fan of Re:fine or Re:store. Anything prior to 2008 means nothing to me because it includes lasers that I have no use for. I am a fan of Re:pair simply because that is what helped me. I have always read that Re:pair can penetrate to 1.4 mm at 70 mj. Get your rullers out folks, not many scars are deeper than that. SanJoseSkin explained the mj settings in this thread http://www.acne.org/...eeks-ago-ugghh/ . I don't pretend to understand the science behind this, and you probably understand it much better than I. The ablative fractionalized CO2 laser is being used to treat the Bern Triplets. http://today.msnbc.m...-have-new-hope/ This technology is very powerful and not for everyone, nor do I recommend this for everyone, but if you can handle this I think it is wonderful.. As Dr. Persky stated above "Fraxel re:pair works, and it works better than any other technology that I have been exposed to during my 25 years of facial cosmetic surgery experience". Everyone should be watching the science behind SCAAR FX http://www.lumenis.c...s/pr_1335047336 As you know the true advancements come very slowly, and I have yet to find out much about SCAAR FX, but Lumenis makes the Deep FX which is similiar to Re:pair.
Dermabrasion - Full Face

CO2 Full Face 1996

Fraxel Re:pair 70 mj - 60% May 22, 2008

Fraxel Re:pair 70 mj - 60% Jan 08, 2009

Fraxel Re:pair 70 mj - 60% Oct 30,2009

Fraxel Re:pair 70 mj - 60% Oct 08,2010

Fraxel Re:pair 70 mj - 60% Nov 04,2011

"The Road To Wellville" 1994
Goodloe Bender: Health! The 'open sesame' to the sucker's purse!