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Acne Prone Skin/sebum Deficient In Linoleic Acid, Possible Topical Solution

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#61 alternativista

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Posted 07 June 2012 - 11:53 AM

would hemp seed oil be just as good as grapeseed oil? i've seen people who recommend it highly above the other oils. if so, what should i look for when buying hemp oil? i have many blocked pores, many of which eventually get inflamed and turn into spots, so i think the oil method would work for me


Since hemp seed has omega 3 EFAs as well, it might be a better, natural replacement for the Allerderm for dogs which has a mix of EFAs. Whether those omega 3 EFAs are beneficial to us/acne, I don't know. It's supposed to be completely noncomodegenic whereas the grapeseed and safflower might be mildly comodegenic. But I haven't had any problem with them, and hemp seed is more expensive.

Status: Clear after 30 years. Wow, I guess it's been 6 years, now.

[ Story: Severe Acne since I was 10. 10+ years of Dermatologists, Antibiotics, topicals and ACCUTANE did nothing. Discovered oranges triggered the worst of my cystic acne = about 70% improvement. Tried some nutrient supplements like B-complex with zinc and C, saw palmetto and a BHA like the aspirin mask = more improvement, a lot less oily. Then, Diet changes = Clear.

Regimen: Anti-inflammatory, nutrient dense, blood sugar stabilizing diet and supplements (for hormones, inflammation, aging, health). No soap or other cleanser except for hand washing! Water only or Oil cleanse. Aloe Vera mixed with niacinimide and a high linoleic acid oil for moisturizer and reduce pigmentation.

Diet effects acne in so many ways: hormone balance, inflammation, Insulin levels, digestion, allergies and intolerances, liver function, adrenal function, SHBG levels, sebum quality, cell function and turnover, nutrient deficiencies, body fat, etc. Basic advice: Eat, sleep, supplement and exercise like you are a diabetic. And eat real food!

For more information, see my Good Things for Acne thread *Moderator edit - Please refer to the board rules (see “Advertising/soliciting”, “Linking” and “Signatures”)*

When you eat stuff, Stuff Happens!


#62 SuperMachii

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Posted 10 June 2012 - 05:27 PM

is there anyway for the body to normalize sebum quality by itself? anyway to correct this linoleic deficiency from the inside through some calculated diet/supplements?
I'm usually talking in reference to my clogged pores/blackheads etc.

#63 doodleme123

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Posted 11 June 2012 - 01:31 AM

^ Good question.

My sebum quality is very waxy and therefore very sticky.

''I'm not clever, but I figure if I ask all the questions, somebody else might have all the answers'' - Quote, Me!


#64 alternativista

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Posted 11 June 2012 - 10:10 AM

is there anyway for the body to normalize sebum quality by itself? anyway to correct this linoleic deficiency from the inside through some calculated diet/supplements?


Well, since one theory is that the relative deficiency is due to the linoleic acid being diluted by excess sebum, anything that reduces excess sebum would help:

Foods that improve the PPAR receptor balance (which is what accutane does) such as resveraterol, sesamin (as in sesame seed), chlorophyll, fish oil/omega 3s, and linoleic acid. Also stable blood sugar/insulin.
http://www.acne.org/...n/#entry3234944

Anything that supports thyroid function helps as thyroid hormone affects the composition of lipids:
http://www.acne.org/...n/#entry3235072

Avoiding trans fats as studies have found that it accelerates the break down of linoleic and alpha linoleic acids
http://www.acne.org/...n/#entry3235308

Gut flora also apparently affect lipid metabolism/profile in tissues. I don't know how, but I have an abstract to a study/report that says so:
http://www.acne.org/...20#entry3242187


(The next topics about enzymes and possible mutations are harder to understand and simplify, and the points at which I start feeling to tired to continue and quit trying to get to the bottom of it all. But I suspect the root cause of our deficiency is here. Enzymes are how your genes do their jobs, btw.)

Retinoids also affect lipids in sebum:

A phenotype mutation in the enzyme stearoyl-CoA desaturase 1 (SCD1 has been found in problem skin.
http://www.acne.org/...n/#entry3235335 Coenzyme A/B5 are supplements that may improve this function.

Beta carotene and UV rays (sunlight) might stimulate retinoid production in the skin. I started gathering info on that here: http://www.acne.org/...00#entry3233046 And in the next post. The CYP26AI enzyme is involved in retinoic acid in the skin. I think it breaks it down, therefore we want to inhibit it. also affects vitamin D synthesis.

Melatonin - So cancer studies have found that 'high levels of melatonin released by the pineal gland block the ability of tumors to take up linoleic acid and convert it to 13-HODE (a molecule called 13-hydroxyoctadecadienoic acid). While exposed to light, however, melatonin levels are extremely low, and tumors are no longer protected by melatonin from the tumor-stimulating action of linoleic acid' Yeah, so that's about cancer cells. But I'd say that as natural as possible circadian cycle will improve your lipid profile and linoleic acid deficiency in sebaceous glands. Maybe the ability of your sebacious glands to take up linoleic acid.


Avoid Aspirin and other NSAIDS. And steroids like cortisone:

the non-steroidal anti-inflammatory drugs (NSAIDs; antirheumatic drugs) like aspirin interfere with the complicated fatty acid metabolism via enzyme in­hibition it is recommended to take into account any possible side effects of medication.
By means of the enzyme phospholipase A2, arachidonic acid is released from phospho­lipids. Prescriptions containing cortisone act as enzyme inhibitors and thus will prevent the formation of arachidonic acid metabolites which support inflammations. Any inflammatory processes in the skin can thus be treated immediately and also very effectively. The other side of the coin is, however, that the skin will develop deficiencies in the supply of other important fatty acids, a fact that will consequently result in atrophic skin.

(And see, I've decided that my dog scratches and chews himself to occupy himself whenever I leave him home alone. Like the dog version of cutting. So I'd nearly decided to take him to the vet for a cortisone shot to stop all the itching and hopefully by the time it wears off, the habit will be broken. But doing so will make his deficiency worse at the same time. )

------------------------

Also note that peroxidated squalene has been implicated as a cause of the inflammation that is at the root of malformed cells that don't differentiate properly. http://www.acne.org/...0#entry3242146 And olive oil is high in squalene. http://www.acne.org/...20#entry3242176

-----------------------------------------------

Apparently 3 genes have been identified that affect the lipid profile in skin:
Changes in at least 3 groups of genes encoding structural proteins, epidermal proteases and protease inhibitors predispose to a defective epidermal barrier and increase the risk of developing atopic dermatitis. http://www.acne.org/...20#entry3238844


And if we do have mutations in our genes/enzymes that govern these processes, then I'd say a topical application of linoleic acid is important.

Edited by alternativista, 12 June 2012 - 09:38 AM.

Status: Clear after 30 years. Wow, I guess it's been 6 years, now.

[ Story: Severe Acne since I was 10. 10+ years of Dermatologists, Antibiotics, topicals and ACCUTANE did nothing. Discovered oranges triggered the worst of my cystic acne = about 70% improvement. Tried some nutrient supplements like B-complex with zinc and C, saw palmetto and a BHA like the aspirin mask = more improvement, a lot less oily. Then, Diet changes = Clear.

Regimen: Anti-inflammatory, nutrient dense, blood sugar stabilizing diet and supplements (for hormones, inflammation, aging, health). No soap or other cleanser except for hand washing! Water only or Oil cleanse. Aloe Vera mixed with niacinimide and a high linoleic acid oil for moisturizer and reduce pigmentation.

Diet effects acne in so many ways: hormone balance, inflammation, Insulin levels, digestion, allergies and intolerances, liver function, adrenal function, SHBG levels, sebum quality, cell function and turnover, nutrient deficiencies, body fat, etc. Basic advice: Eat, sleep, supplement and exercise like you are a diabetic. And eat real food!

For more information, see my Good Things for Acne thread *Moderator edit - Please refer to the board rules (see “Advertising/soliciting”, “Linking” and “Signatures”)*

When you eat stuff, Stuff Happens!


#65 Tunnelvisionary

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Posted 11 June 2012 - 05:52 PM

I've been using grapeseed oil on my face once a day for about two weeks now and I gotta say there is a noticeable improvement. At the very least, it's really nice to rinse my face with. But I do notice improvements in my skin texture, and it helps reduce the redness.

Could using BP have contribute to a linoleic acid deficiency in sebum?
Call me TV.

Posted Imagemoonbase, on , said:

To the OP. Dieting is silly. The only point of a diet should be to heal your body. Once that's done as long as you get the nutrients you need in you diet, you can eat whatever the hell you want. I think that's the big thing people are missing.

#66 alternativista

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Posted 12 June 2012 - 11:47 AM

I've been using grapeseed oil on my face once a day for about two weeks now and I gotta say there is a noticeable improvement. At the very least, it's really nice to rinse my face with. But I do notice improvements in my skin texture, and it helps reduce the redness.

Could using BP have contribute to a linoleic acid deficiency in sebum?


I don't know. I've only found info on steroids and NSAIDS inhibiting enzymes involved in lipid metabolism. You'd have to see if it hinders the processes any. I've seen a lot of info on peroxidated lipids, especially squalene as being a major culprit in acne as a source of inflammation.

And yeah, one of the many good things linoleic acid in sebum does is inhibit melatonin. I think it's evening out my skin tone too. Pretty quickly. And I'd been doing other things that are supposed to help with that. Niacinimide for example.

Edited by alternativista, 13 June 2012 - 07:19 AM.

Status: Clear after 30 years. Wow, I guess it's been 6 years, now.

[ Story: Severe Acne since I was 10. 10+ years of Dermatologists, Antibiotics, topicals and ACCUTANE did nothing. Discovered oranges triggered the worst of my cystic acne = about 70% improvement. Tried some nutrient supplements like B-complex with zinc and C, saw palmetto and a BHA like the aspirin mask = more improvement, a lot less oily. Then, Diet changes = Clear.

Regimen: Anti-inflammatory, nutrient dense, blood sugar stabilizing diet and supplements (for hormones, inflammation, aging, health). No soap or other cleanser except for hand washing! Water only or Oil cleanse. Aloe Vera mixed with niacinimide and a high linoleic acid oil for moisturizer and reduce pigmentation.

Diet effects acne in so many ways: hormone balance, inflammation, Insulin levels, digestion, allergies and intolerances, liver function, adrenal function, SHBG levels, sebum quality, cell function and turnover, nutrient deficiencies, body fat, etc. Basic advice: Eat, sleep, supplement and exercise like you are a diabetic. And eat real food!

For more information, see my Good Things for Acne thread *Moderator edit - Please refer to the board rules (see “Advertising/soliciting”, “Linking” and “Signatures”)*

When you eat stuff, Stuff Happens!


#67 Tunnelvisionary

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Posted 13 June 2012 - 07:36 PM


I've been using grapeseed oil on my face once a day for about two weeks now and I gotta say there is a noticeable improvement. At the very least, it's really nice to rinse my face with. But I do notice improvements in my skin texture, and it helps reduce the redness.

Could using BP have contribute to a linoleic acid deficiency in sebum?


I don't know. I've only found info on steroids and NSAIDS inhibiting enzymes involved in lipid metabolism. You'd have to see if it hinders the processes any. I've seen a lot of info on peroxidated lipids, especially squalene as being a major culprit in acne as a source of inflammation.

And yeah, one of the many good things linoleic acid in sebum does is inhibit melatonin. I think it's evening out my skin tone too. Pretty quickly. And I'd been doing other things that are supposed to help with that. Niacinimide for example.

Hm, I think in some ways, BP might have done things to my skin to make it more acne prone. Just a hunch.

The vitamin E in grapeseed might also be having a beneficial effect on my skin. I think doing things to my skin that make it less acne prone is also a pretty good approach in addition to a healthy lifestyle. Nuking my face with BP was only a temporary solution and only served to age my skin along with bad health habits.
Call me TV.

Posted Imagemoonbase, on , said:

To the OP. Dieting is silly. The only point of a diet should be to heal your body. Once that's done as long as you get the nutrients you need in you diet, you can eat whatever the hell you want. I think that's the big thing people are missing.

#68 FSAS

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Posted 14 June 2012 - 02:41 AM


I've been using grapeseed oil on my face once a day for about two weeks now and I gotta say there is a noticeable improvement. At the very least, it's really nice to rinse my face with. But I do notice improvements in my skin texture, and it helps reduce the redness.

Could using BP have contribute to a linoleic acid deficiency in sebum?


I don't know. I've only found info on steroids and NSAIDS inhibiting enzymes involved in lipid metabolism. You'd have to see if it hinders the processes any. I've seen a lot of info on peroxidated lipids, especially squalene as being a major culprit in acne as a source of inflammation.

And yeah, one of the many good things linoleic acid in sebum does is inhibit melatonin. I think it's evening out my skin tone too. Pretty quickly. And I'd been doing other things that are supposed to help with that. Niacinimide for example.


hey guys since seeing this post i bought some grapeseed oil and was washing my face with it every night.
Basically the first week my skin was super smooth, loved it. for about 1-2 and a half weeks my face was the clearest it has been in about a year (not kidding) to the point i forgot about my acne i was actually incredibly happy, I thought this was my solution. Kept using the grapeseed oil, nearly finished my big bottle and sadly my face broke out during my period (usually im clearest on my period) and since then my face has been a pizza face again. last night it was so horrible worst its been in a long time. my skin also doesnt feel as smooth as it did when i first started using the grapeseed. :(
sigh! totally had SO much faith in it. Does anyone know why maybe the effect wore off? The effect of my face was far too noticable so i know it was the grapeseed that altered my face to clear it up, to the point i didnt even have red marks..but yeah its all back again. mostly around my forehead and mouth/chin (i guess the typical hormonal).
I'm going to the health store soon and will buy a different brand. do you think maybe my grapeseed oil went off? didnt smell off though.

but yeah still following this post im still intrigued :)

#69 alternativista

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Posted 14 June 2012 - 12:19 PM

hey guys since seeing this post i bought some grapeseed oil and was washing my face with it every night.
Basically the first week my skin was super smooth, loved it. for about 1-2 and a half weeks my face was the clearest it has been in about a year (not kidding) to the point i forgot about my acne i was actually incredibly happy, I thought this was my solution. Kept using the grapeseed oil, nearly finished my big bottle and sadly my face broke out during my period (usually im clearest on my period) and since then my face has been a pizza face again. last night it was so horrible worst its been in a long time. my skin also doesnt feel as smooth as it did when i first started using the grapeseed. Posted Image
sigh! totally had SO much faith in it. Does anyone know why maybe the effect wore off? The effect of my face was far too noticable so i know it was the grapeseed that altered my face to clear it up, to the point i didnt even have red marks..but yeah its all back again. mostly around my forehead and mouth/chin (i guess the typical hormonal).
I'm going to the health store soon and will buy a different brand. do you think maybe my grapeseed oil went off? didnt smell off though.

but yeah still following this post im still intrigued Posted Image


Could you have been overdoing it? It might take more time.

Also, I'm not sure everything lumped together as acne develops with the same pathways. Normal acne is a slow process of malformed cells that don't exfoliate properly without sticking together, clogs a pore far below the surface, then takes weeks to come to the surface. Or so they tell us. Whereas, acne from a food intolerance can appear in a day or so. And acne triggered by monthly hormone changes doesn't take weeks either.

Status: Clear after 30 years. Wow, I guess it's been 6 years, now.

[ Story: Severe Acne since I was 10. 10+ years of Dermatologists, Antibiotics, topicals and ACCUTANE did nothing. Discovered oranges triggered the worst of my cystic acne = about 70% improvement. Tried some nutrient supplements like B-complex with zinc and C, saw palmetto and a BHA like the aspirin mask = more improvement, a lot less oily. Then, Diet changes = Clear.

Regimen: Anti-inflammatory, nutrient dense, blood sugar stabilizing diet and supplements (for hormones, inflammation, aging, health). No soap or other cleanser except for hand washing! Water only or Oil cleanse. Aloe Vera mixed with niacinimide and a high linoleic acid oil for moisturizer and reduce pigmentation.

Diet effects acne in so many ways: hormone balance, inflammation, Insulin levels, digestion, allergies and intolerances, liver function, adrenal function, SHBG levels, sebum quality, cell function and turnover, nutrient deficiencies, body fat, etc. Basic advice: Eat, sleep, supplement and exercise like you are a diabetic. And eat real food!

For more information, see my Good Things for Acne thread *Moderator edit - Please refer to the board rules (see “Advertising/soliciting”, “Linking” and “Signatures”)*

When you eat stuff, Stuff Happens!


#70 FSAS

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Posted 15 June 2012 - 07:31 AM


hey guys since seeing this post i bought some grapeseed oil and was washing my face with it every night.
Basically the first week my skin was super smooth, loved it. for about 1-2 and a half weeks my face was the clearest it has been in about a year (not kidding) to the point i forgot about my acne i was actually incredibly happy, I thought this was my solution. Kept using the grapeseed oil, nearly finished my big bottle and sadly my face broke out during my period (usually im clearest on my period) and since then my face has been a pizza face again. last night it was so horrible worst its been in a long time. my skin also doesnt feel as smooth as it did when i first started using the grapeseed. Posted Image
sigh! totally had SO much faith in it. Does anyone know why maybe the effect wore off? The effect of my face was far too noticable so i know it was the grapeseed that altered my face to clear it up, to the point i didnt even have red marks..but yeah its all back again. mostly around my forehead and mouth/chin (i guess the typical hormonal).
I'm going to the health store soon and will buy a different brand. do you think maybe my grapeseed oil went off? didnt smell off though.

but yeah still following this post im still intrigued Posted Image


Could you have been overdoing it? It might take more time.

Also, I'm not sure everything lumped together as acne develops with the same pathways. Normal acne is a slow process of malformed cells that don't exfoliate properly without sticking together, clogs a pore far below the surface, then takes weeks to come to the surface. Or so they tell us. Whereas, acne from a food intolerance can appear in a day or so. And acne triggered by monthly hormone changes doesn't take weeks either.


do you mean washing my face with it every night would help? the odd thing is for 2 weeks it definitely seemed a miracle, I've been using it for over a month though. perhaps it wasnt the grapeseed at all but i havnt been clear in a long time and i think that was the closest i have been to clear.. i understand over doing anything is bad but would washing every night be bad? if anything wouldn't that be a good thing i wonder?

also you mentioned how long pimples form, how long do hormonal pimples take to form because my face can easily go from lots of pimples to none in literally a day, for example 2 nights ago I had a lot of tiny white heads on my cheeks..got depressed and just went to bed still back to square one. in the morning most were gone and my usual pimples just remained. so i guess sleep helps greatly but yeah i guess im a little mixed up but my acne definitely gets worse after my period and often before..even though last month was an odd month where i got more acne during my period for the first time ever (usually im clearest when on my period) so very confused right now but then again i never did have a clue whats going on with my face ..

what acne are you suggesting linoleic acid helps? I thought it was the general skin and 'fixing it' to the state where acne of all sorts is prevented from forming type thing?

#71 alternativista

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Posted 15 June 2012 - 08:47 AM

do you mean washing my face with it every night would help? the odd thing is for 2 weeks it definitely seemed a miracle, I've been using it for over a month though. perhaps it wasnt the grapeseed at all but i havnt been clear in a long time and i think that was the closest i have been to clear.. i understand over doing anything is bad but would washing every night be bad? if anything wouldn't that be a good thing i wonder?

also you mentioned how long pimples form, how long do hormonal pimples take to form because my face can easily go from lots of pimples to none in literally a day, for example 2 nights ago I had a lot of tiny white heads on my cheeks..got depressed and just went to bed still back to square one. in the morning most were gone and my usual pimples just remained. so i guess sleep helps greatly but yeah i guess im a little mixed up but my acne definitely gets worse after my period and often before..even though last month was an odd month where i got more acne during my period for the first time ever (usually im clearest when on my period) so very confused right now but then again i never did have a clue whats going on with my face ..

what acne are you suggesting linoleic acid helps? I thought it was the general skin and 'fixing it' to the state where acne of all sorts is prevented from forming type thing?


No I wouldn't think daily cleansing is too much, but that could vary from person to person.

Linoleic acid helps mammalian skin function, period. And it helps true acne as well as other skin problems caused by impaired skin and sebum function such as psoriasis, excema, keratosis pilares, and issues animals get such as hyper sensitivities to fleas and mites. I pretty clearly stated what it does for your skin in the first post and then posted the many studies where i found that information. Deficiencies cause skin problems. And people and animals with skin problems have been found to be deficient in linoleic acid in their sebum.

However, a pimple that appears in a day as an allergic response can't possibly be the result of the normal acne formation. Which is why I don't think it is true acne. It's more like a hive, that the body can make appear and disappear. Only the acne doesnt just disappear like a hive does. It has to heal. And since acne that comes and goes with the menstual cycle also appears within a much shorter time than the several weeks they tell us it takes acne to form, I suspect that maybe it isn't true acne either. But I can't tell you how long it takes to form or why.

Status: Clear after 30 years. Wow, I guess it's been 6 years, now.

[ Story: Severe Acne since I was 10. 10+ years of Dermatologists, Antibiotics, topicals and ACCUTANE did nothing. Discovered oranges triggered the worst of my cystic acne = about 70% improvement. Tried some nutrient supplements like B-complex with zinc and C, saw palmetto and a BHA like the aspirin mask = more improvement, a lot less oily. Then, Diet changes = Clear.

Regimen: Anti-inflammatory, nutrient dense, blood sugar stabilizing diet and supplements (for hormones, inflammation, aging, health). No soap or other cleanser except for hand washing! Water only or Oil cleanse. Aloe Vera mixed with niacinimide and a high linoleic acid oil for moisturizer and reduce pigmentation.

Diet effects acne in so many ways: hormone balance, inflammation, Insulin levels, digestion, allergies and intolerances, liver function, adrenal function, SHBG levels, sebum quality, cell function and turnover, nutrient deficiencies, body fat, etc. Basic advice: Eat, sleep, supplement and exercise like you are a diabetic. And eat real food!

For more information, see my Good Things for Acne thread *Moderator edit - Please refer to the board rules (see “Advertising/soliciting”, “Linking” and “Signatures”)*

When you eat stuff, Stuff Happens!


#72 FSAS

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Posted 15 June 2012 - 06:38 PM


do you mean washing my face with it every night would help? the odd thing is for 2 weeks it definitely seemed a miracle, I've been using it for over a month though. perhaps it wasnt the grapeseed at all but i havnt been clear in a long time and i think that was the closest i have been to clear.. i understand over doing anything is bad but would washing every night be bad? if anything wouldn't that be a good thing i wonder?

also you mentioned how long pimples form, how long do hormonal pimples take to form because my face can easily go from lots of pimples to none in literally a day, for example 2 nights ago I had a lot of tiny white heads on my cheeks..got depressed and just went to bed still back to square one. in the morning most were gone and my usual pimples just remained. so i guess sleep helps greatly but yeah i guess im a little mixed up but my acne definitely gets worse after my period and often before..even though last month was an odd month where i got more acne during my period for the first time ever (usually im clearest when on my period) so very confused right now but then again i never did have a clue whats going on with my face ..

what acne are you suggesting linoleic acid helps? I thought it was the general skin and 'fixing it' to the state where acne of all sorts is prevented from forming type thing?


No I wouldn't think daily cleansing is too much, but that could vary from person to person.

Linoleic acid helps mammalian skin function, period. And it helps true acne as well as other skin problems caused by impaired skin and sebum function such as psoriasis, excema, keratosis pilares, and issues animals get such as hyper sensitivities to fleas and mites. I pretty clearly stated what it does for your skin in the first post and then posted the many studies where i found that information. Deficiencies cause skin problems. And people and animals with skin problems have been found to be deficient in linoleic acid in their sebum.

However, a pimple that appears in a day as an allergic response can't possibly be the result of the normal acne formation. Which is why I don't think it is true acne. It's more like a hive, that the body can make appear and disappear. Only the acne doesnt just disappear like a hive does. It has to heal. And since acne that comes and goes with the menstual cycle also appears within a much shorter time than the several weeks they tell us it takes acne to form, I suspect that maybe it isn't true acne either. But I can't tell you how long it takes to form or why.


sorry yes i did read everything was just getting confused as I thought either way acne was acne if its a pimple on your face than I figured it was acne rather than it being true, im not really sure what true means i guess the type that takes weeks to form. Which doesnt make too much sense for my kind because it definitely of how it appears around my period.
im sorry if you've answered me this before but even so with acne that relates around a period, i realize its a certain hormone doing that but why does that cause pimples to form? i guess put more simply what does too much of that hormone trigger?
that could be a broad question you dont have to answer that haha.

I suppose I put hope in linoleic acid for hormonal acne, i will keep using it though.
back to th drawing board I expect :/
honest to god dont even know what to do ive tried everything and i dont even say that with an ignorant manner, i really have tried every possible approach.

hmph.
i will buy a hopeful better quality grapeseed oil when i get the chance

#73 SuperMachii

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Posted 16 June 2012 - 09:38 AM

Topical application is still only a part of things you have can do to control acne.. but diet control is a better way of controlling acne.. and THE diet that reverses the acne prone nature into a strong stable system that takes care of the person automatically is.. well.. the cure right?

I'd just like to add here that.. in a thread about mainly topical application, the other 2 or 3 things you have to do to help fight acne should be at least pointed out somewhere, forgive meh if it has already.

what's the idea or thinking of why this grapeseed oil and safflower oil will work?

-how does it prevent acne from forming, how does it disrupt the acne forming system?
-what does it do to existing pimples? how does it affect/alter the sebum in formed acne?
-does it help normalize sebum? does it liquidify waxy thick sebum into.. waterry thin sebum?

I guess I'm a disbeliever, but a few kinds of oils applied topically is supposed to do all that? What if it doesn't work? I know controlling acne and pimples is one thing.. but actually changing the acne-prone nature of the skin (the thick abnormal sebum).. that's a tough ass game to win.

Edited by Wangod, 16 June 2012 - 10:03 AM.

I'm usually talking in reference to my clogged pores/blackheads etc.

#74 alternativista

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Posted 16 June 2012 - 12:27 PM

what's the idea or thinking of why this grapeseed oil and safflower oil will work?

-how does it prevent acne from forming, how does it disrupt the acne forming system?
-what does it do to existing pimples? how does it affect/alter the sebum in formed acne?
-does it help normalize sebum? does it liquidify waxy thick sebum into.. waterry thin sebum?


I think linoleic acids role in sebum and skin is pretty clearly spelled out in the first post and title.

Status: Clear after 30 years. Wow, I guess it's been 6 years, now.

[ Story: Severe Acne since I was 10. 10+ years of Dermatologists, Antibiotics, topicals and ACCUTANE did nothing. Discovered oranges triggered the worst of my cystic acne = about 70% improvement. Tried some nutrient supplements like B-complex with zinc and C, saw palmetto and a BHA like the aspirin mask = more improvement, a lot less oily. Then, Diet changes = Clear.

Regimen: Anti-inflammatory, nutrient dense, blood sugar stabilizing diet and supplements (for hormones, inflammation, aging, health). No soap or other cleanser except for hand washing! Water only or Oil cleanse. Aloe Vera mixed with niacinimide and a high linoleic acid oil for moisturizer and reduce pigmentation.

Diet effects acne in so many ways: hormone balance, inflammation, Insulin levels, digestion, allergies and intolerances, liver function, adrenal function, SHBG levels, sebum quality, cell function and turnover, nutrient deficiencies, body fat, etc. Basic advice: Eat, sleep, supplement and exercise like you are a diabetic. And eat real food!

For more information, see my Good Things for Acne thread *Moderator edit - Please refer to the board rules (see “Advertising/soliciting”, “Linking” and “Signatures”)*

When you eat stuff, Stuff Happens!


#75 wicky

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Posted 16 June 2012 - 02:01 PM

you are truly amazing alternativista!! I feel this lack of linoleic acid is the cause of my skin to be in a constant state of clogged pores, dry skin, seborrheic dermatitis, food intolerances. I have changed my diet almost 2 years ago and my skin is worse now than ever. I loved reading all the info about being deficient in linoleic acid and therefore sebum is more sticky, this is exactly my problem in my chin area and I have not been able to change. Ive applied grapeseed oil a year ago as my moisturizer and it only added to my problems. I take good supplements and eat well but have a problem with oils topically for some reason. I did ALCAT testing and was found intolerant to many foods (which i've avoided for 3 months and no improvment) and many types of fish were a problem so Im not sure how to increase my lipid level or change my sebum. I am recently trying cod liver oil but its only been a few days. Do you think applying grapeseed oil to say my forehead where i dont have clogs or ingesting it would help? I cant change my skin and its killing me after all these years...Also is grapeseed extract supplments the same as grapeseed oil?

#76 alternativista

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Posted 16 June 2012 - 02:07 PM

Do you think applying grapeseed oil to say my forehead where i dont have clogs or ingesting it would help? I cant change my skin and its killing me after all these years...Also is grapeseed extract supplments the same as grapeseed oil?


The extracts are probably about the poly phenols and other phytonutrients with the oil removed. And yes, you can apply it elsewhere. Use it on your arms, hands and legs.

Edited by alternativista, 17 June 2012 - 09:29 AM.

Status: Clear after 30 years. Wow, I guess it's been 6 years, now.

[ Story: Severe Acne since I was 10. 10+ years of Dermatologists, Antibiotics, topicals and ACCUTANE did nothing. Discovered oranges triggered the worst of my cystic acne = about 70% improvement. Tried some nutrient supplements like B-complex with zinc and C, saw palmetto and a BHA like the aspirin mask = more improvement, a lot less oily. Then, Diet changes = Clear.

Regimen: Anti-inflammatory, nutrient dense, blood sugar stabilizing diet and supplements (for hormones, inflammation, aging, health). No soap or other cleanser except for hand washing! Water only or Oil cleanse. Aloe Vera mixed with niacinimide and a high linoleic acid oil for moisturizer and reduce pigmentation.

Diet effects acne in so many ways: hormone balance, inflammation, Insulin levels, digestion, allergies and intolerances, liver function, adrenal function, SHBG levels, sebum quality, cell function and turnover, nutrient deficiencies, body fat, etc. Basic advice: Eat, sleep, supplement and exercise like you are a diabetic. And eat real food!

For more information, see my Good Things for Acne thread *Moderator edit - Please refer to the board rules (see “Advertising/soliciting”, “Linking” and “Signatures”)*

When you eat stuff, Stuff Happens!


#77 SuperMachii

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Posted 16 June 2012 - 04:05 PM

I think linoleic acids role in sebum and skin is pretty clearly spelled out in the first post and title.



Ok I guess it does.. see comments.. answers.. some more doubts, questions..

-----------------------------------------
-how does it prevent acne from forming, how does it disrupt the acne forming system? (anti-inflammatory/reduced inflammation, antimicrobial, ok..)

-what does it do to existing pimples? (this is not really answered but you can't exactly anti-inflame an existing acne or make the pimple dissapear any faster than normal unaltered process, but i suppose an anti-inflammatory response will help at least like 5% or something).

-how does it affect/alter the sebum in formed acne? (I can't really believe it will do this, I don't think grapeseed oil/safflower is strong enough to normalize existing sebaceous conditions like pustules, clogged pores, active sebum filled pimples, I can't imagine it willl liquidify hard sebum pebbles in pores or melt blackheads, or liquidify waxy pustules.)

-does it help normalize sebum? does it liquidify waxy thick sebum into.. waterry thin sebum? (you mentioned regulating PPAR receptors that will be reducing sebum production. So it somehow alters the sebum controller receptors and boom, less sebum? I dont know.. I don't think it works like that, imo.
Also,how strong is grapeseed oil/safflower oil, how long does it take? does it clog pores? has it been tested, can you point me to the post where there is information on that?)


---------------------------------------
I hope you don't think I'm attacking you, these 2 products (grapeseed and safflower) do not seem much different than some thing like jojoba oil or.. olive oil, tea tree oil which I heard some of the same things about, and their pros did not outweigh the cons to me and they definitely did not reduce sebum production for me atleast.)

Research is one thing, but what if these products only work for weaker acne? Have you found any numbers/percentages in your research? Such as at what rate the sebum was decreased? have humans been tested? this would allow us to guesstimate on how long to use these grapeseed/saff oils..can you point me to some measured results? I also don't think I found any cons listed in your post.. atleast not in the first post.

Edited by Wangod, 16 June 2012 - 04:16 PM.

I'm usually talking in reference to my clogged pores/blackheads etc.

#78 alternativista

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Posted 17 June 2012 - 09:38 AM


I think linoleic acids role in sebum and skin is pretty clearly spelled out in the first post and title.



Ok I guess it does.. see comments.. answers.. some more doubts, questions..

-----------------------------------------
-how does it prevent acne from forming, how does it disrupt the acne forming system? (anti-inflammatory/reduced inflammation, antimicrobial, ok..)

-what does it do to existing pimples? (this is not really answered but you can't exactly anti-inflame an existing acne or make the pimple dissapear any faster than normal unaltered process, but i suppose an anti-inflammatory response will help at least like 5% or something).

-how does it affect/alter the sebum in formed acne? (I can't really believe it will do this, I don't think grapeseed oil/safflower is strong enough to normalize existing sebaceous conditions like pustules, clogged pores, active sebum filled pimples, I can't imagine it willl liquidify hard sebum pebbles in pores or melt blackheads, or liquidify waxy pustules.)

-does it help normalize sebum? does it liquidify waxy thick sebum into.. waterry thin sebum? (you mentioned regulating PPAR receptors that will be reducing sebum production. So it somehow alters the sebum controller receptors and boom, less sebum? I dont know.. I don't think it works like that, imo.
Also,how strong is grapeseed oil/safflower oil, how long does it take? does it clog pores? has it been tested, can you point me to the post where there is information on that?)


---------------------------------------
I hope you don't think I'm attacking you, these 2 products (grapeseed and safflower) do not seem much different than some thing like jojoba oil or.. olive oil, tea tree oil which I heard some of the same things about, and their pros did not outweigh the cons to me and they definitely did not reduce sebum production for me atleast.)

Research is one thing, but what if these products only work for weaker acne? Have you found any numbers/percentages in your research? Such as at what rate the sebum was decreased? have humans been tested? this would allow us to guesstimate on how long to use these grapeseed/saff oils..can you point me to some measured results? I also don't think I found any cons listed in your post.. atleast not in the first post.


I'm on my iPad so it's too difficult to respond to everything, especially since it means me retyping things i already wrote. And I'm sorry, but these questions are goofy in light of the information I've provided. Try reading it again.

Those two oils are very high in the linoleic acid that we are deficient in as stated in the third item in the bulleted list. Linoleic acid is what this thread is about. That's why it's in the title.

I can't tell you how long it would take for your skin to improve.

And it affects acne formation in many more ways, as listed in the first post. It's a vital component in the ceramides that make skin strong, less permeable and easily damaged, etc. it increases the lamellar bodies that produce the enzymes that separate cells so they exfoliate freely. It inhibits dht production, and so on. It is a vital component to sebum that functions as it is supposed to.

And all of the studies that I have found have been posted here in this thread. But you are welcome to do some research yourself.

Edited by alternativista, 22 April 2014 - 11:09 AM.

Status: Clear after 30 years. Wow, I guess it's been 6 years, now.

[ Story: Severe Acne since I was 10. 10+ years of Dermatologists, Antibiotics, topicals and ACCUTANE did nothing. Discovered oranges triggered the worst of my cystic acne = about 70% improvement. Tried some nutrient supplements like B-complex with zinc and C, saw palmetto and a BHA like the aspirin mask = more improvement, a lot less oily. Then, Diet changes = Clear.

Regimen: Anti-inflammatory, nutrient dense, blood sugar stabilizing diet and supplements (for hormones, inflammation, aging, health). No soap or other cleanser except for hand washing! Water only or Oil cleanse. Aloe Vera mixed with niacinimide and a high linoleic acid oil for moisturizer and reduce pigmentation.

Diet effects acne in so many ways: hormone balance, inflammation, Insulin levels, digestion, allergies and intolerances, liver function, adrenal function, SHBG levels, sebum quality, cell function and turnover, nutrient deficiencies, body fat, etc. Basic advice: Eat, sleep, supplement and exercise like you are a diabetic. And eat real food!

For more information, see my Good Things for Acne thread *Moderator edit - Please refer to the board rules (see “Advertising/soliciting”, “Linking” and “Signatures”)*

When you eat stuff, Stuff Happens!


#79 alternativista

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Posted 18 June 2012 - 09:40 AM

I've been meaning to post the brand of oil I use that I keep referring to as Napa something. It's Napa Valley Naturals. And I don't recall if they were on the list of olive oils studied for quality that we discussed a while back, but the oils from California that were tested were all of high quality as opposed to those from Italy. And they bottle it properly and provide all the info on the label like a good olive oil should. They seem to assume their customers are intelligent and they can't get away with not doing things right. All oils are in dark bottles, the olive oil states the acidity like a quality oil should, the grapeseed oil label states the linoleic acid content, they state the acceptable cooking temperatures, etc.

Status: Clear after 30 years. Wow, I guess it's been 6 years, now.

[ Story: Severe Acne since I was 10. 10+ years of Dermatologists, Antibiotics, topicals and ACCUTANE did nothing. Discovered oranges triggered the worst of my cystic acne = about 70% improvement. Tried some nutrient supplements like B-complex with zinc and C, saw palmetto and a BHA like the aspirin mask = more improvement, a lot less oily. Then, Diet changes = Clear.

Regimen: Anti-inflammatory, nutrient dense, blood sugar stabilizing diet and supplements (for hormones, inflammation, aging, health). No soap or other cleanser except for hand washing! Water only or Oil cleanse. Aloe Vera mixed with niacinimide and a high linoleic acid oil for moisturizer and reduce pigmentation.

Diet effects acne in so many ways: hormone balance, inflammation, Insulin levels, digestion, allergies and intolerances, liver function, adrenal function, SHBG levels, sebum quality, cell function and turnover, nutrient deficiencies, body fat, etc. Basic advice: Eat, sleep, supplement and exercise like you are a diabetic. And eat real food!

For more information, see my Good Things for Acne thread *Moderator edit - Please refer to the board rules (see “Advertising/soliciting”, “Linking” and “Signatures”)*

When you eat stuff, Stuff Happens!


#80 Tunnelvisionary

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Posted 18 June 2012 - 09:48 AM

I've been meaning to post the brand of oil I use that I keep referring to as Napa something. It's Napa Valley Naturals. And I don't recall if they were on the list of olive oils studied for quality that we discussed a while back, but the oils from California that were tested were all of high quality as opposed to those from Italy. And they bottle it properly and provide all the info on the label like a good olive oil should. They seem to assume their customers are intelligent and they can't get away with not doing things right. All oils are in dark bottles, the olive oil states the acidity like a quality oil should, the grapeseed oil label states the linoleic acid content, they state the acceptable cooking temperatures, etc.

I'll look for that brand. I thought the oil I got came in a green bottle (green lets less light in than clear, but not as great as brown) but it turns out that was the color of the oil. Haha.

I still really enjoy using this stuff. My skin seems to shed better.
Call me TV.

Posted Imagemoonbase, on , said:

To the OP. Dieting is silly. The only point of a diet should be to heal your body. Once that's done as long as you get the nutrients you need in you diet, you can eat whatever the hell you want. I think that's the big thing people are missing.


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