46 replies to this topic

[onefatalgoose]

And this forum is filled with people for whom it didn't work. And with people who chose not to use medicines that cause harm.

 

This forum is also filled with people who haven't made much progress with their acne in years. So not much of an argument.

 

 

I believe the argument here is still that benzoyl peroxide works for some, and doesn't for others.  And for the people it does work for, they are still subjecting their skin to extremely high levels of oxidative stress, which causes the redness, dryness, itchiness, and long term skin damage from free radicals.  So...while it may be effective at treating acne for many people, it comes with a price.  

 

The same can be said for most if not all modern medicines.  They may serve the purpose they are prescribed for, but they come with a whole host of side-effects that interfere with other important metabolic processes.  They are band-aid fixes, and most illness/disease can be prevented and even reversed via proper nutrition and avoidance of toxic foods so commonly found in the western diet.  

 

Also, what about green tea cream?  Apparently there was a study conducted by a Dr. Jennifer Gan-Wong from the Memorial Medical Center in the Philippines that showed a 3% concentration of green tea cream was as effective at treating acne as a 4% concentration of benzoyl peroxide.  I wish i could find the actual study itself.  It is cited repeatedly, but i'd still love to see the study.  I think you have to pay a monthly fee to get access to some of these studies, which is unfortunate.  

[sepsi]

I believe the argument here is still that benzoyl peroxide works for some, and doesn't for others.  And for the people it does work for, they are still subjecting their skin to extremely high levels of oxidative stress, which causes the redness, dryness, itchiness, and long term skin damage from free radicals.  So...while it may be effective at treating acne for many people, it comes with a price.  

 

The same can be said for most if not all modern medicines.  They may serve the purpose they are prescribed for, but they come with a whole host of side-effects that interfere with other important metabolic processes.  They are band-aid fixes, and most illness/disease can be prevented and even reversed via proper nutrition and avoidance of toxic foods so commonly found in the western diet.  

 

Also, what about green tea cream?  Apparently there was a study conducted by a Dr. Jennifer Gan-Wong from the Memorial Medical Center in the Philippines that showed a 3% concentration of green tea cream was as effective at treating acne as a 4% concentration of benzoyl peroxide.  I wish i could find the actual study itself.  It is cited repeatedly, but i'd still love to see the study.  I think you have to pay a monthly fee to get access to some of these studies, which is unfortunate.  

 

 

I'm not arguing against the statement that BP has side-effects, or that it's an oxidizing agent and causes oxidative damage in the skin. I argue against black and white thinking that's so prevalent here. I argue against statements like 'BP causes oxidative damage, therefore it's automatically bad and should be shunned'.

 

Here's the point that argument misses. ACNE itself causes a lot of oxidative damage on the skin. So if something reduces acne it most likely reduces inflammation in the skin.

 

The way I see it is that BP causes little oxidative damage to prevent bigger damage from occuring. This is evident from the fact that for many people, but not for everybody, acne goes away and skin becomes less red and irritated when they use BP.

 

I'm the first person to admit that BP can also make your skin worse. If you use too much of it or the concentration is too strong. And with moisturizers or antioxidant creams you can mitigate the damage even further.

 

If you can find a natural cream that gets the same results, then fantastic. So far there has been done, and I'm pretty up to date with research on acne. As I said, there are some promising candidates, like niacin and vitamin C derivates. Green tea catechins might also work, but so far the studies have been way too small and inconclusive to say for sure.

 

I'm not aware of the study you are referring to. This is the latest green tea related acne study in the PubMed index:

 

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/23096708

[alternativista]

And this forum is filled with people for whom it didn't work. And with people who chose not to use medicines that cause harm.

 
This forum is also filled with people who haven't made much progress with their acne in years. So not much of an argument.

It has a few people that haven't made much progress, including some who have real health issues. Most people who clear their skin stop posting regularly. But the forum is filled with how I cleared my skin threads.

Edited by alternativista, 22 February 2013 - 08:43 AM.

[alternativista]

The value of green tea/EGCG has been known for a while, but this study identifies several factors affected by topical EGCG

Epigallocatechin-3-Gallate Improves Acne in Humans by Modulating Intracellular Molecular Targets and Inhibiting P. acnes.
[url=http://www.ncbi.nlm....ubmed?term=Yoon JY[Author]&cauthor=true&cauthor_uid=23096708]Yoon JY

Source
Acne Research Laboratory, Seoul National University Hospital, Seoul, South Korea.



Abstract

Acne vulgaris is a highly prevalent skin disorder characterized by hyperseborrhea, inflammation, and Propionibacterium acnes overgrowth. Only isotretinoin and hormonal therapy reduce sebum production. To identify a new drug candidate that modulates sebum, we examined the effects of EGCG, the major polyphenol in green tea, on human SEB-1 sebocytes and in patients with acne. In SEB-1 sebocytes, we found that EGCG reduced sebum by modulating the AMPK-SREBP-1 signaling pathway. EGCG also reduces inflammation by suppressing the NF-κB and AP-1 pathways. EGCG also induces cytotoxicity of SEB-1 sebocytes via apoptosis and decreases the viability of P. acnes, thus targeting almost all the pathogenic features of acne. Finally, and most importantly, EGCG significantly improved acne in an 8-week randomized, split-face, clinical trial, and was well tolerated. Our data provide a therapeutic rationale for the use of EGCG in acne.


 

[sepsi]

The value of green tea/EGCG has been known for a while, but this study identifies several factors affected by topical EGCG

 

There are also a few other green tea studies. The problem is that none of them are definitive. The study you referred was mostly in vitro, though it also had an in vivo part. These studies are interesting and provide some evidence for green tea and EGCG but the problem is that they don't have proper controls. Once we see a few studies with 100 or so participants that compare EGCG cream to BP head to head then I can say that there's reasonably good evidence for it. Such studies exists for vitamin B3 and vitamin C derivates.

[Binga]

I would also add topical vitamin b5 to the list. It was greatly reduced the oiliness in my face if not acne. If there is a moisturizer with high amounts of B5, B3, C, E, zinc, EGCC, Thyme and hyalauronic acid then there should not be any chance of acne at all.

Edited by Binga, 25 February 2013 - 08:55 AM.

[alternativista]

This article about a study involving the mapping of the genomes and identifying several different strains od P. Acnes finds a strain predominant in clear skin. Theorizes that it provides protection against harmful microbes in the skin similar to the way beneficial flora do in your intestines.

http://news.sciencem...er-.html?ref=hp