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Repairing the long-term damage from Accutane

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#3901 Dubya_B

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Posted 15 November 2013 - 10:35 PM

I totally agree with Annoy. It is clear that accutane stays in the body for a very long time 10-20 years or even more, it seems the more it stays in the body , more mineral and vitamin deficient it causes, also damage to the organs, cells and tissue . It's all about deficiency and toxicity , unfortunatelly it seems that most of us here had or still have those two problems that were caused by accutane.

Where is the evidence of this if it is so clear?

Where is the evidence of deficiency or toxicity you are so adamantly sure of?

Is this idea being rectally synthesized, or is there some iota of reason behind it?

 

Accutane isn't a heavy metal or asbestos.

Every bit of evidence points to the drug being cleared within several days:

 

(13-cis-retinoic acid is a.k.a. isotretinoin and Accutane)

 

http://europepmc.org...act/MED/7808019

The clinical pharmacology of all-trans retinoic acid (RA) has distinct differences from that of its widely studied stereoisomer 13-cis retinoic acid (cRA). RA is much more rapidly cleared from plasma following oral administration; their respective half-lives are < 1 h and 13 h

There's 168 hours in a week. This is around 13 13-hour half-lives. 1*0.5^13 leaves you with about One Ten-Thousandths of the peak concentration still left after one week.

 

Wanna err on the high side?.....

 

http://onlinelibrary...4388.x/abstract

"Values for elimination half-life (t1/2) of isotretinoin and its metabolite were 29 ± 40 hours and 22 ± 10 hours, respectively."

1*0.5^6 leaves you with only One Percent of peak concentration after a week.

 

 

Do you think this is all the more it takes to continue destroying your intestines, making your hair fall out, or making you too tired to get out of bed?

 

Well, ..........a very small concentration of 13-cis-retinoic (isotretinoin) is always present at low ambient levels as a bi-product of vitamin-A metabolism whether you took Accutane or not:

 

 

 

http://www.jlr.org/c.../31/2/175.short

 

"13-cis-retinoic acid is an endogenous compound in human serum."

 

http://www.jlr.org/c...31/8/1445.short

 

Our findings suggest that, in addition to all-trans-retinoic acid, 13-cis-retinoic acid and 13-cis-4-oxoretinoic acid are present in normal human plasma as metabolites of vitamin A.

 

If your health has improved after detoxing or liver cleansing, it was certainly not a result of removing Accutane from your body.

 

There must be several posters here with a broken internet who lack the resources to look up this information for themselves, but insist the drug being "stuck" inside of us as the only explanation for long-term effects.

 

 

Guitarman, just a friendly warning; Isotherapy is a homeopathic scam. Save your money and go on a little vacation or something instead. There's alternative medicine, and then there's snake oil. The line between the two often narrows, but this without a doubt, falls into the latter category.


Edited by Dubya_B, 16 November 2013 - 12:07 AM.


#3902 Dubya_B

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Posted 15 November 2013 - 11:13 PM

Epigenetic mechanisms do respond to the environment, and can be reversed naturally by certain factors, but not always. This is an incorrect assumption to make.

 

Many seemingly irreversible diseases have been linked to known or unknown environmental triggers, and often there is a genetic predisposition.

 

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/19833297

Epigenetic mechanisms such as DNA methylation and modifications to histone proteins regulate high-order DNA structure and gene expression. Aberrant epigenetic mechanisms are involved in the development of many diseases, including cancer. The neurological disorder most intensely studied with regard to epigenetic changes is Rett syndrome; patients with Rett syndrome have neurodevelopmental defects associated with mutations in MeCP2, which encodes the methyl CpG binding protein 2, that binds to methylated DNA. Other mental retardation disorders are also linked to the disruption of genes involved in epigenetic mechanisms; such disorders include alpha thalassaemia/mental retardation X-linked syndrome, Rubinstein-Taybi syndrome, and Coffin-Lowry syndrome. Moreover, aberrant DNA methylation and histone modification profiles of discrete DNA sequences, and those at a genome-wide level, have just begun to be described for neurodegenerative disorders such as Alzheimer's disease, Parkinson's disease, and Huntington's disease, and in other neurological disorders such as multiple sclerosis, epilepsy, and amyotrophic lateral sclerosis.

 Take PTSD and schizophrenia into consideration also, as these are known have epigenetic components and can be triggered into adulthood.

 

Additionally, cellular differentiation is largely controlled by DNA methylation and DNA methylation is somewhat controlled by cellular differentiation. Environmental factors only go so far into explaining it. Certain cell types are programmed to have specific genes turned on or off, which actually determines how they function. From my understanding, this would be difficult to reverse if Accutane affected this system, but not necessarily impossible.

 

Something I find very interesting is the few recoveries resulting from water fasting. It has been shown in vitro, that if a cell is starved for long enough, it will begin shedding epigenetic tags and makes its way back towards pluripotency. I'm not sure if this has anything to do with the fasting recoveries since it would be difficult to accomplish the level of "starvation" as in the in-vitro experiments while still living, but it is something to think about.

I have completed a 7 day water fast, and a couple other sufferers have gone 21 and 28 days without remission of symptoms, so it is not a sure thing.

 

 

I have a friend of a friend who was left with ulcerative colitis, severe headaches, and arthritic symptoms that began shortly after a course of Accutane in high-school. She eats organic, makes a living from organic farming, and basically lives organic, but still suffers severe side effects. ...It only helps so much. I will try to get her on this board if I get a chance to speak with her again soon.

 

The sad fact of the matter is we really don't have a good understanding of what this drug did to us, leaving us with very little choice at the moment besides trying to live healthy and "poking and hoping" with different therapies, whether natural or pharmaceutical.

 



#3903 anonyy

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Posted 16 November 2013 - 03:26 AM

If accutane and other toxins are expelled, if the body return to a good state, those "epigenetic" change will be no more, the body will readapt itself. It's just that the body can't deal with all things at the same times. Epigenetic is a really bad excuse, i'm convinced of that, at least saying that it's permanent. If it was permanent, my neurological symptoms will be still here, but they are gone.

And epigenetic about accutane is just a theory, i don't even think that it can cause modification. I think accutane directly block some gene expression in certain part of the body but it's limited and doesn't do any modification. It affect the gene expression system in itself, not the mechanism who make a real modification or not (my opinion). If he was doing change, our body within 2 years will be completely malformated like babys who born after accutane, all trans retinoic acid regulate too much genes, if it was doing modification, we will be simply dead.

Isotherapy is homeopathy but with the exact same molecule who caused the problems. You can't do it yourself it's too dangerous.. ask an homeopathic lab. There is 1 or 2 who can do it in europe, don't know for usa.

 

 

Again, epigenetics, strictly defined, is about heritable changes in gene expression. What is being described here is any change in gene expression that can be induced by outside influences. They are not the same. Again, epigenetic changes are long term changes that are potentially heritable, and, as I pointed out above, most epigenetic changes are not passed on to offspring, certainly not to the point that they have a detectable effect on evolution. The rest is gene regulation, which is often transient but, depending on the process, can continue long term for as long as the stimulus causing the change in regulation is present. As is frequently pointed out, the quickest way to get an organ to start to return to normal is to stop doing the bad things to it that were causing it dysfunction in the first place. As P.Z. Myers put it:

 

In part, the root of the problem here is that we’re falling into an artificial dichotomy, that there is the gene as an enumerable, distinct character that can be plucked out and mapped as a fixed sequence of bits in a computer database, and there are all these messy cellular processes that affect what the gene does in the cell, and we try too hard to categorize these as separate. It’s a lot like the nature-nurture controversy, where the real problem is that biology doesn’t fall into these simple conceptual pigeonholes and we strain too hard to distinguish the indistinguishable. Grok the whole, people! You are the product of genes and cellular and environmental interactions.

 

http://scienceblogs....think-it-means/


Edited by anonyy, 16 November 2013 - 05:09 AM.


#3904 MovingOn

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Posted 16 November 2013 - 08:12 AM

On LDN for month 1.5, doing even better on 4.5mg. sleeping like a baby, no joint pain, no anxiety, no mucus, moist eyes, moist nose, better moisture in face.  still have dry skin though, especially hands.  Everywhere else, I'm a happy camper.  The amount of pain I was experiencing got me hospitalized into a psych ward and guess what, they thought I was a hypochondriac and found NOTHING wrong.  I strongly believe I personally suffer from an allergic/autoimmune response and my body is just attacking it self.  I don't know how the DHT inhibition plays into that, and why it seems so permanent, but I am still sensitive to that.  I strongly believe that diet can help, but i'm not bought into the cure piece yet...i havn't tried it for long enough though.  high stress jobs demand energy and i am  having trouble finding a new lower stress one...so for now...it's LDN since I can live a normal life finally. No negative side effects besides occasional constipation but now I take a massive amount of probiotics since my testing showed ZERO beneficial flora...that will wreak havoc on the body and cause something autoimmune from my limited understanding,  I also take magnesium glycinate for bowel movements, D3 since I was on the low end, and biotin which I am not bought in that biotin works for hair loss...I do think diet can help that.  We shall see.  I've been trying to get this squared away for 9 years. my sides hit most severely 7 years later, and i think chronic stress was a major trigger for it. I don't know if I believe A is still in my body, but i do think due to the chronic cellular dehydration, there is some buildup of SOMETHING that prevents my body from cleaning or healing itself.  what that something is i don't know...



#3905 guitarman01

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Posted 16 November 2013 - 09:29 AM

http://www.medicalin.../toxicity1.html

 

very informative website  on the liver and detoxifying it based on phase 1 and phase 2 and  Glucuronidation

​talks about how important cysteine is for sulfur and  Glutathione production, that is essential for liver detox. and  to help expel fat soluable toxins including retinoids  through glucuronidation which can be benifited by supplementing artichoke, calcium d glucarate and Kombucha(this article stating that artichoke is a much better source of Glucuronic Acid. goes into great detail covering a whole range of topics related to what many are dealing with from accutane.     just one quote :     


Inefficient liver functioning (and chiefly low Glutathione production, rapid Glutathione depletion and poor Glucuronidation) can lead to 'metabolic poisoning', i.e. the build up of metabolites within the cells, tissues and organs of the body that have not been processed by the liver and excreted. Quoted from ARL Pathology's Web Site (see the pdf for the full article and related diagrams):

      there are some references in this article and some of this info is known to be based on fact. and some is probably just based on theories.


Edited by guitarman01, 16 November 2013 - 09:33 AM.


#3906 TaneAbomination

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Posted 16 November 2013 - 12:59 PM

Is anyone reading this forum who suffers from sexual dysfunction due to Accutane recovered or shown improvements?

 

I was one of those unfortunate people.  I say "was" because I eventually recovered sexual function & libido returned too.

 

I must have tried a million things, spent thousands of dollars, seen doctors who shrugged their shoulders at me, also tried fasting & switching to organic, expensive supplements, etc. etc. etc. But anyone reading this needs to refer to December 2012 of this incredibly long forum.  Someone named AccutaneIsPoison posted his remedy - I tried his proposed remedy for about for 5 months, and improvements came slowly.  Also a great remedy for anyone suffering from depression (which isotretinoin can cause to the point of suicide).  Today, I'm able to have sex with my wife without use of viagra, cialis or any of that other crap.  Post accutane - I was quite dead and had no interest in sex at all.

 

Anyone interested go back to Nov/Dec 2012 posts and read the posts by AccutaneIsPoision and the research he provided on this forumj - this is real medicine and should be taken seriously.



#3907 ChampionBlood

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Posted 16 November 2013 - 04:13 PM

Is anyone reading this forum who suffers from sexual dysfunction due to Accutane recovered or shown improvements?

 

I was one of those unfortunate people.  I say "was" because I eventually recovered sexual function & libido returned too.

 

I must have tried a million things, spent thousands of dollars, seen doctors who shrugged their shoulders at me, also tried fasting & switching to organic, expensive supplements, etc. etc. etc. But anyone reading this needs to refer to December 2012 of this incredibly long forum.  Someone named AccutaneIsPoison posted his remedy - I tried his proposed remedy for about for 5 months, and improvements came slowly.  Also a great remedy for anyone suffering from depression (which isotretinoin can cause to the point of suicide).  Today, I'm able to have sex with my wife without use of viagra, cialis or any of that other crap.  Post accutane - I was quite dead and had no interest in sex at all.

 

Anyone interested go back to Nov/Dec 2012 posts and read the posts by AccutaneIsPoision and the research he provided on this forumj - this is real medicine and should be taken seriously.

 

I couldn't find his posts, but I did see people quoting him. Maybe he erased the posts? If the proposed treatment is cannabis oil, I'm very skeptical, but I would be willing to try anything reasonable at this point. Also, I'm in a state where cannabis is effectively legal and I might very well be able to get the oil pretty easily.



#3908 Dubya_B

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Posted 16 November 2013 - 05:32 PM

If accutane and other toxins are expelled, if the body return to a good state, those "epigenetic" change will be no more, the body will readapt itself. It's just that the body can't deal with all things at the same times. Epigenetic is a really bad excuse, i'm convinced of that, at least saying that it's permanent. If it was permanent, my neurological symptoms will be still here, but they are gone.

And epigenetic about accutane is just a theory, i don't even think that it can cause modification. I think accutane directly block some gene expression in certain part of the body but it's limited and doesn't do any modification. It affect the gene expression system in itself, not the mechanism who make a real modification or not (my opinion). If he was doing change, our body within 2 years will be completely malformated like babys who born after accutane, all trans retinoic acid regulate too much genes, if it was doing modification, we will be simply dead.

Isotherapy is homeopathy but with the exact same molecule who caused the problems. You can't do it yourself it's too dangerous.. ask an homeopathic lab. There is 1 or 2 who can do it in europe, don't know for usa.

 

 

 

Again, epigenetics, strictly defined, is about heritable changes in gene expression. What is being described here is any change in gene expression that can be induced by outside influences. They are not the same. Again, epigenetic changes are long term changes that are potentially heritable, and, as I pointed out above, most epigenetic changes are not passed on to offspring, certainly not to the point that they have a detectable effect on evolution. The rest is gene regulation, which is often transient but, depending on the process, can continue long term for as long as the stimulus causing the change in regulation is present. As is frequently pointed out, the quickest way to get an organ to start to return to normal is to stop doing the bad things to it that were causing it dysfunction in the first place. As P.Z. Myers put it:

 

In part, the root of the problem here is that we’re falling into an artificial dichotomy, that there is the gene as an enumerable, distinct character that can be plucked out and mapped as a fixed sequence of bits in a computer database, and there are all these messy cellular processes that affect what the gene does in the cell, and we try too hard to categorize these as separate. It’s a lot like the nature-nurture controversy, where the real problem is that biology doesn’t fall into these simple conceptual pigeonholes and we strain too hard to distinguish the indistinguishable. Grok the whole, people! You are the product of genes and cellular and environmental interactions.

 

http://scienceblogs....think-it-means/

Do you realize what you just did!?

 

Consider reading the entire article for a fine counterpoint to the argument you are trying to make here.

 

The article you linked openly bashes the alternative medicine community's misuse of epigenetic discoveries for the purpose of scamming customers. The author uses about two-thirds of the post for that purpose:

 

http://scienceblogs....think-it-means/

 

He is also griping about how loosely the idea of environmental factors reversing epigenetic modifications is thrown around. 

 

If you think I'm not very open-minded, check out this guy's writings.

 

In fact, you should totally email him and ask him to chime-in on this thread with his thoughts on homeopathic isotherapy! That would be a treat.

 

 

 

 

There actually does seem to be a misunderstanding between you and me concerning our definitions of epigenetics.

 

You are thinking of isotretinoin's active influence on gene regulation/transcription, intracellular and extracellular signalling, hormonal profiles, etc...

You are right in saying those processes should theoretically cease soon after the drug is stopped.

 

I am speaking of isotretinoin's influence on heritable epigenetic traits through gene methylation. These alterations in methylation can persist through multiple generations of cells as described here:

 

http://www.aps.anl.g...CE_20080910.php

 

Imagine having to copy an entire book by hand without missing a comma. Our cells face a similar task every time they divide. They must duplicate both their DNA and a subtle pattern of punctuation-like modifications on the DNA known as methylation.................

..............................

Scientists refer to methylation, the addition of a methyl group to DNA, as an "epigenetic" modification because it adds a layer of information on top of the genetic sequence of the DNA itself. It marks genes for silencing, which means they do not manufacture proteins.

"The processes that copy the methylation pattern have to be faithful," says senior author Xiaodong Cheng, professor of biochemistry at Emory. "Otherwise, losing DNA methylation marks can have serious consequences, causing genes to become active at the wrong places and times."

These modifications often like to "stick" once they occur.

 

 

 

Why not actually read this instead of blowing it off?:

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/19501473

(This researcher, Anthony Csoka, also authored a paper concerning epigenetic mechanisms underlying persistent SSRI-related sexual dysfunction)

The term "Epigenetics" refers to DNA and chromatin modifications that persist from one cell division to the next, despite a lack of change in the underlying DNA sequence. The "epigenome" refers to the overall epigenetic state of a cell, and serves as an interface between the environment and the genome. The epigenome is dynamic and responsive to environmental signals not only during development, but also throughout life; and it is becoming increasingly apparent that chemicals can cause changes in gene expression that persist long after exposure has ceased. Here we present the hypothesis that commonly-used pharmaceutical drugs can cause such persistent epigenetic changes. Drugs may alter epigenetic homeostasis by direct or indirect mechanisms. Direct effects may be caused by drugs which affect chromatin architecture or DNA methylation. For example the antihypertensive hydralazine inhibits DNA methylation. An example of an indirectly acting drug is isotretinoin, which has transcription factor activity. A two-tier mechanism is postulated for indirect effects in which acute exposure to a drug influences signaling pathways that may lead to an alteration of transcription factor activity at gene promoters. This stimulation results in the altered expression of receptors, signaling molecules, and other proteins necessary to alter genetic regulatory circuits. With more chronic exposure, cells adapt by an unknown hypothetical process that results in more permanent modifications to DNA methylation and chromatin structure, leading to enduring alteration of a given epigenetic network. Therefore, any epigenetic side-effect caused by a drug may persist after the drug is discontinued. It is further proposed that some iatrogenic diseases such as tardive dyskinesia and drug-induced SLE are epigenetic in nature. If this hypothesis is correct the consequences for modern medicine are profound, since it would imply that our current understanding of pharmacology is an oversimplification. We propose that epigenetic side-effects of pharmaceuticals may be involved in the etiology of heart disease, cancer, neurological and cognitive disorders, obesity, diabetes, infertility, and sexual dysfunction. It is suggested that a systems biology approach employing microarray analyses of gene expression and methylation patterns can lead to a better understanding of long-term side-effects of drugs, and that in the future, epigenetic assays should be incorporated into the safety assessment of all pharmaceutical drugs. This new approach to pharmacology has been termed "phamacoepigenomics", the impact of which may be equal to or greater than that of pharmacogenetics. We provide here an overview of this potentially major new field in pharmacology and medicine.....................

........................................

................................

Excerpt: " The following adverse effects have been reported to persist, even after discontinuing therapy, suggesting persistent (or perhaps slowly-reversing) gene expression changes and epigenetic effects: alopecia, arthralgias, ocular abnormalities, inflammatory bowel disease, keloids, osteopenia, hyperlipidemia, erectile dysfunction, and psychiatric disturbances. Isotretinoin is postulated to have complex effects on the brain and central nervous system."


This is a theory, and also the only rational explanation concerning the persitency of our side effects, although it leaves much to be discovered.

 

If I'm writing science fiction here by relating Accutane to more specific epigenetic changes than the author of the above article, then Accutane being "gummed up" in our cells after several years or more is pure fantasy.

 

 

 

TaneAbomination: Thank you very much for taking the time to post your recovery here!


Edited by Dubya_B, 16 November 2013 - 05:35 PM.


#3909 anonyy

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Posted 16 November 2013 - 05:38 PM

Yes, i linked this because he say that the environment influence gene expression, and is reversible if the thing who caused those perturbation of gene expression go away.

Anyway think what you want, but for me epigenetic is a complete scam people use to try to explain what they don't understand. My experience proved me i'm right.


Edited by anonyy, 16 November 2013 - 05:40 PM.


#3910 Gladiatoro

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Posted 16 November 2013 - 07:51 PM

The drug causes permanent damage no question , why are people chronically dehydrated , lose there hair  , have joint pain years later , deal with depression and or anxiety  , have dry red eyes , sexual dysfunction  etc... years later , some people are just lucky due to there genetic makeup and have fewer side effects , also most people who took acctuane and

drink alcohol are hung over for days after why is that , permanent change that's why at a cellular level bottom line it's poison and there is a reason there are tons of law suits against the manufacturer Roche  , some derms say it's the lesser of the evil meaning acne , I beg to disagree unless a person has severe cystic acne and

has tried everything else it's not worth the gamble of your future health. But here we are trying to solve problems caused by this drug , typical allopathic medicine

treat one problem and cause ten others ..... white coat ...... black art..... for me the best thing to do is exercise it makes me feel alive and good that's my remedy .

Ski season is back so that's what I'm doing... and loving it.

 

ps  my word editor is ^&* up and doesn't space my sentences  correctly sorry.... damn computers lol...


Edited by Gladiatoro, 16 November 2013 - 08:01 PM.


#3911 mes6890

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Posted 16 November 2013 - 08:15 PM

I totally agree with Annoy. It is clear that accutane stays in the body for a very long time 10-20 years or even more, it seems the more it stays in the body , more mineral and vitamin deficient it causes, also damage to the organs, cells and tissue . It's all about deficiency and toxicity , unfortunatelly it seems that most of us here had or still have those two problems that were caused by accutane.

 

The reason why I think some people take the drug and take longer or never get side effects are simply because their body detox organs such as the liver , pancreas , kidneys, skin etc were functioning better than the people who got the nasty side effects while taking accutane. You got keep in mind that accutane didn't do this alone, your body has to deal with thousands of toxins each day and remove it somehow from your system , such as Genetically modified organism, gluten, growth hormone ( dairy , meat ) ,fluoride, chlorine, aspartame, MSG, chemicals in tap water, chemicals and additives in your food, toxic vaccines with loads of mercury and aluminum in it and the list goes on and on .

 

Believe me guys. I spent a lot of time and money trying to find a cure, but the cure is within every single one of us. You just need to give your body time and don't do any harm to it ( every single pharmaceutical drugs does harm ) . Diet will help your body eliminate not only accutane but all the mucus, chemicals and heavy metals that you have consumed. First of, dairy and meat will clog you , even in small ammount, it will cause mucus and it will poison your body further . Gluten will do the same , and ruin your D.I tract, some grains also does damage .

 

It seems a bit extreme but the best healing program for accutane sufferes is a low fat raw vegan diet ( organic, fresh , natural fruits ,veggies some nuts and seeds ) and if you have the will power and motivation to do it a long water or juice fasting which will be a thousand times better than just the detox diet alone.

 

I came here to share this with you guys because I had the courage to change radically my lifestyle and heal myself. I used to live in Canada and I am now in the tropics , growing my own organic fruit and veggies.  Accutane gave me some unbeliavable rough time but it has taught me so many great things . Hope you guys can heal all your problems soon..

 

cheers

"Every single pharmaceutical drugs does harm." I'm sorry but that's just ridiculous.

 

And I've said before that I'd be willing to pursue a low fat vegan or even raw diet, but I feel like some folks here are over correcting. I saw someone suggest that fluoride is part of our problem. 

 

More importantly, none of you can prove that adhering to whatever diet/avoidance plan that worked for you will work for the next person, so it's just preposterous to claim that you have universal cures, to be frank. Not enough is known to make claims like that. Period.


Edited by playsomebeat, 16 November 2013 - 08:16 PM.


#3912 ChampionBlood

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Posted 16 November 2013 - 09:54 PM

Yes, i linked this because he say that the environment influence gene expression, and is reversible if the thing who caused those perturbation of gene expression go away.

Anyway think what you want, but for me epigenetic is a complete scam people use to try to explain what they don't understand. My experience proved me i'm right.

 

I'm a firm believer in doing whatever works for you, and I'm glad you were helped by your own treatments, but I think it is foolish to ignore the fact that the "Epigenetic hypothesis" is the most probable etiology in the case of long term Accutane side effects. I came to this conclusion independently, and then I was surprised to see like-mineded people propounding the same theory and presenting some of the same evidence that had convinced me. Its true that epigenetics is a shadowy area in medicine at this time, and as such, it is appropriate to be skeptical of it, but in order to beat this I feel that we must unite behind a single cause and investigate it until we come to some helpful conclusions. Reading this thread you can see that most people are throwing around anecdotal evidence and proposing all kinds of causes for our problems. Currently, this theory is the one that makes the most sense, given the scientific data.

 

I totally agree with Annoy. It is clear that accutane stays in the body for a very long time 10-20 years or even more, it seems the more it stays in the body , more mineral and vitamin deficient it causes, also damage to the organs, cells and tissue . It's all about deficiency and toxicity , unfortunatelly it seems that most of us here had or still have those two problems that were caused by accutane.

 

The reason why I think some people take the drug and take longer or never get side effects are simply because their body detox organs such as the liver , pancreas , kidneys, skin etc were functioning better than the people who got the nasty side effects while taking accutane. You got keep in mind that accutane didn't do this alone, your body has to deal with thousands of toxins each day and remove it somehow from your system , such as Genetically modified organism, gluten, growth hormone ( dairy , meat ) ,fluoride, chlorine, aspartame, MSG, chemicals in tap water, chemicals and additives in your food, toxic vaccines with loads of mercury and aluminum in it and the list goes on and on .

 

Believe me guys. I spent a lot of time and money trying to find a cure, but the cure is within every single one of us. You just need to give your body time and don't do any harm to it ( every single pharmaceutical drugs does harm ) . Diet will help your body eliminate not only accutane but all the mucus, chemicals and heavy metals that you have consumed. First of, dairy and meat will clog you , even in small ammount, it will cause mucus and it will poison your body further . Gluten will do the same , and ruin your D.I tract, some grains also does damage .

 

It seems a bit extreme but the best healing program for accutane sufferes is a low fat raw vegan diet ( organic, fresh , natural fruits ,veggies some nuts and seeds ) and if you have the will power and motivation to do it a long water or juice fasting which will be a thousand times better than just the detox diet alone.

 

I came here to share this with you guys because I had the courage to change radically my lifestyle and heal myself. I used to live in Canada and I am now in the tropics , growing my own organic fruit and veggies.  Accutane gave me some unbeliavable rough time but it has taught me so many great things . Hope you guys can heal all your problems soon..

 

cheers

"Every single pharmaceutical drugs does harm." I'm sorry but that's just ridiculous.

 

And I've said before that I'd be willing to pursue a low fat vegan or even raw diet, but I feel like some folks here are over correcting. I saw someone suggest that fluoride is part of our problem. 

 

More importantly, none of you can prove that adhering to whatever diet/avoidance plan that worked for you will work for the next person, so it's just preposterous to claim that you have universal cures, to be frank. Not enough is known to make claims like that. Period.

 

Every single pharmaceutical drug has side effects. This is what my doctor told me when I visited him last time. Just looking at TV ads for new drugs makes you aware of the bad possibilities that exist for every drug. Those ads, combined with my horrific experience with Accutane has given me a near-phobia of drugs, which I feel is quite justifiable.



#3913 mes6890

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    I also post things on occasion to warn folks of the potential dangers of taking saw palmetto and other DHT inhibitors, based on personal experience and the mounting testimonials of others.
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Posted 16 November 2013 - 10:47 PM

100% understand about fear of pharmaceutical drugs. But Accutane is still in a class of its own, literally. 

 

That said, I am terrified to take much of anything, too. I read an article where one gal cycled through 10+ antidepressants after Accutane to no avail. I am trying to find the article. She was so young.

 

I know the time is coming where my parents and I are going to get into a big argument as I do not wish to go on an antidepressant right now. I feel like it will be throwing darts at the problem. I am going to the Cleveland Clinic soon. Should be interesting. I expect it to be more diagnostic than curative.


Edited by playsomebeat, 16 November 2013 - 10:47 PM.


#3914 Gladiatoro

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Posted 17 November 2013 - 04:14 AM

100% understand about fear of pharmaceutical drugs. But Accutane is still in a class of its own, literally. 

 

That said, I am terrified to take much of anything, too. I read an article where one gal cycled through 10+ antidepressants after Accutane to no avail. I am trying to find the article. She was so young.

 

I know the time is coming where my parents and I are going to get into a big argument as I do not wish to go on an antidepressant right now. I feel like it will be throwing darts at the problem. I am going to the Cleveland Clinic soon. Should be interesting. I expect it to be more diagnostic than curative.

If anything try lithium orotate a natural form of lithium with no negative side effects , and stay far away from ssri's  all you need is more poison in your system , not good.



#3915 anonyy

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Posted 17 November 2013 - 04:30 AM

The drug causes permanent damage no question , why are people chronically dehydrated , lose there hair  , have joint pain years later , deal with depression and or anxiety  , have dry red eyes , sexual dysfunction  etc... years later , some people are just lucky due to there genetic makeup and have fewer side effects , also most people who took acctuane and

drink alcohol are hung over for days after why is that , permanent change that's why at a cellular level bottom line it's poison and there is a reason there are tons of law suits against the manufacturer Roche  , some derms say it's the lesser of the evil meaning acne , I beg to disagree unless a person has severe cystic acne and

has tried everything else it's not worth the gamble of your future health. But here we are trying to solve problems caused by this drug , typical allopathic medicine

treat one problem and cause ten others ..... white coat ...... black art..... for me the best thing to do is exercise it makes me feel alive and good that's my remedy .

Ski season is back so that's what I'm doing... and loving it.

 

ps  my word editor is ^&* up and doesn't space my sentences  correctly sorry.... damn computers lol...


The drug doesn't do permanent damage. It just temporarly poison the body and damage the liver, kidney, skin and make us impossible to get rid of accutane and other poison unless we stop eating bad food and take herbs & remedy to restore those organs. It's the only reason that the effects last so long, our body can't expell all of those toxins, repair the damage, etc.. at the same times, thanks to accutane he can't do any of this.
Epigenetic is a bad excuse, you can't reprogram your body that easy, it's nearly impossible.
Hair loss, gum problem, depression; sexual disfunction, etc.. is the same cause, acidity, toxicity, poisoned enteric nervous system (second brain) & exhaustion of our glandular system.
Anyway i give up, believe what you want, continue to search in other drugs & poison instead of changing your lifestyle and helping your body. It's just sad for you and people who maybe came for a cure and read your lies & negativity here, founded only on a really bad theory who is known false.


Edited by anonyy, 17 November 2013 - 04:32 AM.


#3916 JosephBuchignani

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Posted 17 November 2013 - 08:08 AM

no joint pain, no. 
 
Agreed Nick Ryan, except that it does not logically follow that an epigenetic change induced by environment is therefore reversible by environment. Humpty Dumpty, bullet to the head, etc. 
 
Dubya B, you are on point today. Brainfog clearing?
 
Judging by your second post, yes, undoubtedly. 
 
"Something I find very interesting is the few recoveries resulting from water fasting. It has been shown in vitro, that if a cell is starved for long enough, it will begin shedding epigenetic tags and makes its way back towards pluripotency."
 
Damn, but...
 
" I'm not sure if this has anything to do with the fasting recoveries since it would be difficult to accomplish the level of "starvation" as in the in-vitro experiments while still living, but it is something to think about.
I have completed a 7 day water fast, and a couple other sufferers have gone 21 and 28 days without remission of symptoms, so it is not a sure thing."
 
Ouch. Mega ouch. 
 
Still. "This kind comes out only by fasting and prayer." Something to think about.
 
"She eats organic, makes a living from organic farming, and basically lives organic, but still suffers severe side effects. ...It only helps so much. I will try to get her on this board if I get a chance to speak with her again soon."
 
I'm fascinated by such cases. I wonder how much vegetables and fat she eats. One million percent organic of either would slay me. 
 
Anonyy is probably wonderful to talk to in person. Disorganized posters typically are lively, engaging conversationalists. But not useful on forums. 
 
Ouch, MovingOn. I continue to do quite well on my regimen. Just need the blue blockers to cut the fluorescent light and I'll be 100%. Standing desks help quite a bit with nap adherence and productivity. 
 
Can you summarize Accutaneispoisons recommendations, TaneAbomination? Ah, Rick Simpson oil, yes legit. 
 
"Excerpt: " The following adverse effects have been reported to persist, even after discontinuing therapy, suggesting persistent (or perhaps slowly-reversing) gene expression changes and epigenetic effects: alopecia, arthralgias, ocular abnormalities, inflammatory bowel disease, keloids, osteopenia, hyperlipidemia, erectile dysfunction, and psychiatric disturbances. Isotretinoin is postulated to have complex effects on the brain and central nervous system.""
 
This. 


#3917 JTM88

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Posted 17 November 2013 - 11:40 AM

Those of who suffer super dry skin, hair loss, painful dry lips: read this: 

 

http://www.victoriah...oceramides/9092

 

I been taking phytoceramides for a week now, and have noticed drastic improvements in my skin.  Wouldn't have posted it here if i didnt see good results.  I also started taking it together with hyaluronic acid to see if it can also help my joints.  



#3918 TaneAbomination

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Posted 17 November 2013 - 11:41 AM

@JosephBuchignani - you got it.  No further summary necessary - although I did notice that AccutaneIsPoison's original post was removed which is a bit unnerving.  Anyhow, end of the line for me.  If that didn't work I was exploring very expensive stem cell therapy - thank goodness it didn't come to that.  Cheers!


Edited by TaneAbomination, 17 November 2013 - 11:43 AM.


#3919 JTM88

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Posted 17 November 2013 - 11:45 AM

NIH research on cermides: 

 

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/12553851



#3920 tanedout

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Posted 17 November 2013 - 12:00 PM

@JosephBuchignani - you got it.  No further summary necessary - although I did notice that AccutaneIsPoison's original post was removed which is a bit unnerving.  Anyhow, end of the line for me.  If that didn't work I was exploring very expensive stem cell therapy - thank goodness it didn't come to that.  Cheers!

 

Pleased to hear you're all sorted TaneAbormination - hope myself and others on here can share the same feeling oneday!


As the original post detailing this protocol has gone, can you just confirm how much you were taking? I.e. 3 drops daily or whatever, and assuming this was it - it wasn't combined even with a regular juice fasting or anything like that? And how long until you felt positive effects? Thanks!


Edited by tanedout, 17 November 2013 - 12:01 PM.





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