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Repairing the long-term damage from Accutane

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#3101 and1

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Posted 13 June 2013 - 07:54 AM

Random update: I am back with more UDCA. Recently started taking psyllium husk and benotnite shakes in the morning and in the evening, they helped somewhat. I am just a little more than a week in so lets see how that helps. The problem I have now is that you are not supposed to take any medication or supps within 2 hours of taking bentonite clay. I will probably continue bentonite clay for at least ten more days and than start with UDCA again. UDCA has been the best supp I have tried in a very long time and I am happy to have it in my hands again. My doc told me that I may have to take it long term and then see if the body moves to a new equilibrium, that's what I am talking about.



#3102 JosephBuchignani

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Posted 13 June 2013 - 09:35 AM

Seems UDCA is highly effective. If any of ya'll really can't source UDCA online, I'd probably be willing to ship it at cost from Hong Kong. It's available over the counter here. But let's see if good online options exist first.



#3103 and1

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Posted 13 June 2013 - 11:13 AM

https://www.youtube....h?v=sQbo9Z_sBQY

 

Here in Europe my insurance covers it and different brands are available. It seems like some doctors are not familiar with it and are quite skeptical while other say there are very few downsides compared to most pharmaceuticals, so it is worth a try.



#3104 Chico Esposito

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Posted 13 June 2013 - 03:55 PM

What happens with me is when i eat retinol in any form, it pushes the accutane out of the receptors and into my bloodstream / lymph / circulation, whatever happens, it creates an almost immediate toxic shock. The question is just what amount of accutane is stored in my body? If it's months worth of the 80mg dose i was prescribed then your talking about potentially 1000's of mg of accutane flushing back into the system at one time. The results of which have been very damaging to my health. If i was to paradoxically take accutane again (never in a billion years but for the sake of this hypothetical argument say i did) i would supplement with UDCA /TUDCA to protect my liver, as it's the most powerful liver protector. So much so that people running heavy oral doses of steroids cycle this in with the methylated compounds to protect themselves.

 

Milk thistle doesn't work, bitters do help the frequency in terms of going the toilet but do nothing to remove the accutane, saunas don't work in my experience. If you are going to eat retinol then it's only logical to supp udca/ tudca to protect the body from the toxic shock. As far as dryness goes, i've completely removed the evening primrose and other oils because the effects were minimal and have started taking udo's choice oil. My skin is oily like pre accutane now, so if thats your only side effect it's something to consider at least.



#3105 camaroz28

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Posted 13 June 2013 - 08:27 PM

Goosnargh-

 

Firstoff, you have the best profile picture i've seen yet.

 

Oh, Hufflepuff × 2. In what known universe does a bear rocking out with a faux guitar trump the mysticism and enchantment evoked by a seahorse? I don’t expect an answer, because there isn’t one, other than a unicorn and they are mythical. And FYI:  “Seahorse is the title given to 54 species of marine fish in the genus Hippocampus. "Hippocampus" comes from the Ancient Greek hippos meaning "horse" and kampos meaning "sea monster".[



#3106 Gladiatoro

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Posted 13 June 2013 - 09:22 PM

http://www.naturalne...od_disease.html



#3107 MovingOn

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Posted 13 June 2013 - 09:36 PM

well just because you don't expect an answer, doesn't mean you don't get one. Clearly a bear rocking out on a guitar trumps the mysticism of a sea horse....especially if it's on a modest mouse album...... OHHH SNAPPPP. OH NE SHE DITTTINNNTTT. I'm just kidding, but the bear playing guitar is much more aligned with my belief in what is mystical in this life....kind of like a velociraptor (spelling?) riding a unicycle. Any analysis of the mysticism ruins the mysticism.



#3108 camaroz28

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Posted 13 June 2013 - 10:13 PM

well just because you don't expect an answer, doesn't mean you don't get one. Clearly a bear rocking out on a guitar trumps the mysticism of a sea horse....especially if it's on a modest mouse album...... OHHH SNAPPPP. OH NE SHE DITTTINNNTTT. I'm just kidding, but the bear playing guitar is much more aligned with my belief in what is mystical in this life....kind of like a velociraptor (spelling?) riding a unicycle. Any analysis of the mysticism ruins the mysticism.

 

Ooooh, well you went there. You know that Isaac Brock has referred to himself as "white trash," and "dumber than the dirt on the ground"? His lyrics on the other hand, are critically acclaimed as genius and Nietschzean inspired. I really don't feel I need to defend the epic seahorse further.



http://www.naturalne...od_disease.html

You are harder to get rid of than the Olsen twins. Ben Gibbard hit the point when he said: “Our memories rely on a faulty camera in our mind.” I don’t think you have a camera in there, but rather an art school flunky trying to sketch beyond his or her abilities. I know you mean well, but you are repetitive son.



And, please don't you go dissing Death Cab for Cutie, or Ben Gibbard for that matter, just like Zooey Deschanel did.



#3109 and1

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Posted 14 June 2013 - 05:16 AM

What happens with me is when i eat retinol in any form, it pushes the accutane out of the receptors and into my bloodstream / lymph / circulation, whatever happens, it creates an almost immediate toxic shock. The question is just what amount of accutane is stored in my body? If it's months worth of the 80mg dose i was prescribed then your talking about potentially 1000's of mg of accutane flushing back into the system at one time. The results of which have been very damaging to my health. If i was to paradoxically take accutane again (never in a billion years but for the sake of this hypothetical argument say i did) i would supplement with UDCA /TUDCA to protect my liver, as it's the most powerful liver protector. So much so that people running heavy oral doses of steroids cycle this in with the methylated compounds to protect themselves.

 

Milk thistle doesn't work, bitters do help the frequency in terms of going the toilet but do nothing to remove the accutane, saunas don't work in my experience. If you are going to eat retinol then it's only logical to supp udca/ tudca to protect the body from the toxic shock. As far as dryness goes, i've completely removed the evening primrose and other oils because the effects were minimal and have started taking udo's choice oil. My skin is oily like pre accutane now, so if thats your only side effect it's something to consider at least.

 

I would like to discuss oils a little, any input welcome. Are there any oils you guys recommend trying for acne and recovery.

 

Tried and worked: Olive oil, peppermint oil aids digestion

 

No effect: Coconut oil, Linseed oil, Walnut Oil, all the other mainstream oils available in the average supermarket

 

Want to try: Black currant seed oil, evening primrose oil, grape seed oil, fermented CLO

 

Also I recommend peppermint oil and oregano oil to fight disease, they work wonders for me


Edited by Believe, 15 June 2013 - 03:15 AM.


#3110 MovingOn

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Posted 14 June 2013 - 07:13 AM

hahha genius? every artist is called that at one time or another. Don't believe everything you read.  People say that Kanye is genius...HAHA. Personally I believe trent reznor is genius...based upon my own inclinations...not something i read on the internet ;)



#3111 Chico Esposito

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Posted 14 June 2013 - 07:16 AM

What happens with me is when i eat retinol in any form, it pushes the accutane out of the receptors and into my bloodstream / lymph / circulation, whatever happens, it creates an almost immediate toxic shock. The question is just what amount of accutane is stored in my body? If it's months worth of the 80mg dose i was prescribed then your talking about potentially 1000's of mg of accutane flushing back into the system at one time. The results of which have been very damaging to my health. If i was to paradoxically take accutane again (never in a billion years but for the sake of this hypothetical argument say i did) i would supplement with UDCA /TUDCA to protect my liver, as it's the most powerful liver protector. So much so that people running heavy oral doses of steroids cycle this in with the methylated compounds to protect themselves.

 

Milk thistle doesn't work, bitters do help the frequency in terms of going the toilet but do nothing to remove the accutane, saunas don't work in my experience. If you are going to eat retinol then it's only logical to supp udca/ tudca to protect the body from the toxic shock. As far as dryness goes, i've completely removed the evening primrose and other oils because the effects were minimal and have started taking udo's choice oil. My skin is oily like pre accutane now, so if thats your only side effect it's something to consider at least.

 

I would like to discuss oils a little, any input welcome. Are there any oils you guys recommend trying for acne and recovery.

 

Tried and worked: Olive oil, peppermint oil aids digestion

 

No effect: Coconut oil, all the other mainstream oils available in the average supermarket

 

Want to try: Black currant seed oil, evening primrose oil, grape seed oil, fermented CLO

 

Also I recommend peppermint oil and oregano oil to fight disease, they work wonders for me

 

I'd recommend Udo's choice, people get caught up in the whole fish oil thing. It only contains EPA and DHA, these are two essential fatty acids that the body can synthesize from ALA and plant based omega 3's. It's like for example vitamin A, it comes in the form of carotene and retinol. Carotene contains natural antioxidants that are all different, based on the colour of the vegetable / fruit. These different antioxidants protect the cell from oxitave stress. The body takes a small amount of these carotenes and synthesizes retinol with it, then it gets converted to a tiny tiny amount of retinoic acid in the cell. It's a closely monitered system but taking carotene is much better than retinol because the carotenes have various antioxidants and it allows the body to synthesize only the amount it needs.

 

Likewise this can be expanded to omega fats, plant based like Ala contain lignans and various anti cancer agents, the body converts what it needs to EPA/ DHA and so on. It's actually the bad omega 6 fats in peoples diets that are messing people up, if you replace the cooked processed omega 6's with unprocessed, unheated omega 6's you get more benefit. The ratio should be 2:1:1. For people with no sebum post accutane, the basic building blocks of sebum are omega 3 and omega 6, the over use of oleic acid as found in olive oil can mess up the ratio's and acne can result.

 

The first thing i'd take if i had acne would be udo's choice oil and i'd make sure that i avoided fatty meats in favour of chicken, lean fish etc, i'd also eat avocado's in salads and only non heated good fats, i'd grill all my meat, as to avoid cooking in fat. I'd stay away from moisturizers and chemicals in general, wash my face with only a simple cleanser like cetaphil. I'd take 4 tablespoons of udo's choice per day, to correct an imbalance of omega 3/6/9 and acne will clear up pretty quickly. Of course the diet would also be 100% natural foods and i'd drink 8-10 pints of water per day, that's a very important step.



#3112 mikkia

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Posted 14 June 2013 - 07:24 AM

What supplements are beneficial while on Accutane? Currently I'm taking vitamin C, E, D3 and B5, Zinc and omega 3. I thought about quitting vitamin B5 now that i ran out of it though.

 

I was prescribed Accutane when other medications and treatments failed. Hope you guys can help!



#3113 camaroz28

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Posted 14 June 2013 - 07:42 AM

wink.png 

Want to try: Black currant seed oil, evening primrose oil, grape seed oil, fermented CLO

Well, you have a cacophony of 5@-reductase inhibitors right there, and no one has said a word. You would think after all the poison admonishments that have been made here, people would actually care a little.

 



hahha genius? every artist is called that at one time or another. Don't believe everything you read.  People say that Kanye is genius...HAHA. Personally I believe trent reznor is genius...based upon my own inclinations...not something i read on the internet wink.png

 

 

The Virginia Woolf connection makes them special without even trying. I'm sure the genius categorization vis-à-vis the mouse has been much more prevalent than the same categorization directed at Victoira Legrand, for example (I respect her). I think they are both great, so let’s no split hairs. Also, my usage of their tour posters (dates and venues listed) here, is more about the Woolf passage and its relevance to behavior demonstrated here. People claiming that they have this because its boosts their ego, for example, when they are getting the basics wrong on a daily basis. Another alarming occurrence is people not doing their own search with authoritative sources, but, who will then take advice from misinformed charlatans on the net, because they decided long ago that they do not believe everything they read on the net.


Edited by camaroz28, 14 June 2013 - 08:15 AM.


#3114 JosephBuchignani

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Posted 14 June 2013 - 09:50 AM

chico what specific foods cause this retinol reaction, and which do not? i'm skeptical but open to convincing. 

 

For example, shrimp has 4% vit A RDA and yet causes no ill effects for me. 



#3115 sbowlchica

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Posted 14 June 2013 - 01:27 PM

MET. FUCKING. FORMIN.

 

I was doing so well... but now I guess the metformin has kicked in, and my hair loss is as bad as ever, and my skin is dry, and I'm tired all the time and I can't sleep. This has been the last straw for conventional medicine.

 

Oh, Metformin. Hopefully thy damage is not permanent.



#3116 MovingOn

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Posted 14 June 2013 - 02:10 PM

clearly we are all below you Cam. We don't know anything. It sucks being a Lemming.



#3117 oli girl

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Posted 14 June 2013 - 03:04 PM

What supplements are beneficial while on Accutane? Currently I'm taking vitamin C, E, D3 and B5, Zinc and omega 3. I thought about quitting vitamin B5 now that i ran out of it though.
 
I was prescribed Accutane when other medications and treatments failed. Hope you guys can help!

You might want post this question somewhere else as we don't promote accutane in this thread! Accutane is toxic! Sorry!

Edited by oli girl, 14 June 2013 - 03:06 PM.


#3118 Chico Esposito

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Posted 14 June 2013 - 03:28 PM

chico what specific foods cause this retinol reaction, and which do not? i'm skeptical but open to convincing. 

 

For example, shrimp has 4% vit A RDA and yet causes no ill effects for me. 

 

Butter, Cod liver oil, calfs liver, lambs liver, cheese, fatty fish like wild salmon and sardines things like that. Shrimp is low in fat and contains only a small amount of retinol, so it might not cause any symptoms with you Joseph, in my case my retinol sensitivity is heightened and i would react to even 1 egg yolk or a small amount of shrimp. My eyes would start to get dry out and my skin would become drier, face would flush and get redder etc.

In my case all foods with retinol cause problems with me, although shrimp causes nowhere near the problem butter causes, because it contains much less retinol. My reaction is directly proportional to the amount of retinol in the food. Everyone has different side effects, but if someone suffers from hairloss only, and ingests lots of retinol, their hair will start falling out much worse. Regardless of the side effect you have if you take retinol post accutane it will aggravate it. 

 

In your case  increasing your fat intake will only increase your bile output, as bile gets released in the presence of dietary fat. UDCA being the strong liver protector that it is, could offset some of the symptoms of eating retinol foods, and subsequently the side effects of doing so. It will also offset the problems with eating fatty foods. If accutane is stored in the fat and retinol aggravates it by pushing it back into the bloodstream, then high fat intake could also mediate some of the damage. As fat soluble toxins get bound to fat, a higher fat diet would bind more accutane offering more protection.


Edited by Chico Esposito, 14 June 2013 - 03:45 PM.


#3119 Dubya_B

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Posted 14 June 2013 - 03:32 PM

Youtube video concerning Accutane/Roaccutane side effects and Jesse Jones' suicide:

 

http://www.youtube.c...h?v=IuyKz81iGhI



#3120 camaroz28

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Posted 14 June 2013 - 08:12 PM

chico what specific foods cause this retinol reaction, and which do not? i'm skeptical but open to convincing. 

 

For example, shrimp has 4% vit A RDA and yet causes no ill effects for me. 

 

Regardless of the side effect you have if you take retinol post accutane it will aggravate it. 

 I have hard evidence the problem extends way beyond this. On my second course of Accutane my doctor prescribed 60mgs a day - that was double my first dose. At that second dosage, I couldn't even leave the house because the entire portion of my chin area was scabbing up and bleeding. I went through the extreme sensitivity to food issue for about 3 years after the crash with beta-carotene (the body uses only what it needs is more bullshit).

 

When the sensitivity issue passed I became incredibly intrigued. I began experimenting based on the notions of perhaps resetting receptor expression (androgen, RAR, retinoid X, etc). Well guess what, at doses of 100mgs+ of brand name Accutane; I had no classic signs whatsoever. I even had nocturnal erections on that dose, which I don’t even have when I am clean. I hope you finally concede that things change, but the condition persists unwaveringly.






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