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I have a question on a liver cleanse...


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#21 BenKweller

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Posted 19 August 2004 - 10:29 AM

When did the "Western diet" begin, anyway? If our grandparents and great grandparents from the early 1900s had acne, do you think we can blame it on them eating the good ole' loaf of bread every week? Everyone here clearly likes to demonize the West and say how terrible everything we do is; how acne is something that's our fault and you guys even cite BS studies that say this. The study that suggested the link to acne was shit just because it was clearly a hypothesis-proof study instead of the other way around. The researcher wanted to find a link and had no problem when looking at cultures like that. I didn't believe it just because it relied on a doctor looking at peoples' skin and then saying that their diet and nothing else caused their freedom from problems. Believe what you want but do you really think that the 16 year olds from countries where any food at all is a blessing have acne because of what they eat? I don't believe it; and I don't believe a 10 year old has liver stones. If so, you must be subjecting him to some pretty crappy food everyday, Denise.

#22 bestscreennameever

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Posted 19 August 2004 - 11:05 AM

I think I smell a rat...

#23 bestscreennameever

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Posted 19 August 2004 - 11:06 AM

Ben16, after you do this, please do come back and share your results. Good luck and be careful. smile.gif

#24 SweetJade1980

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Posted 19 August 2004 - 01:23 PM

QUOTE (BenKweller @ Aug 18 2004, 10:56 PM)
So if someone ate no sugar or junk food, they'd never have acne? You want to commit to that statement before I prove that it can't be true? smile.gif


Sure. I KNOW and have POSTED repeatedly the scientific studies to back it up. I will say it again, for certain individuals, at least 60 among the acne boards that I'm aware of, not to mention those on other chronic health & hormonal disorder boards, that avoidance of such a diet gives one anyway between 95% - 100% clear skin. Heck, medications and topicals couldm't even give me that. ;-)

#25 cynic

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Posted 19 August 2004 - 01:44 PM

QUOTE (SweetJade1980 @ Aug 19 2004, 12:10 PM)
Sure. I KNOW and have POSTED repeatedly the scientific studies to back it up. I will say it again, for certain individuals, at least 60 among the acne boards that I'm aware of, not to mention those on other chronic health & hormonal disorder boards, that avoidance of such a diet gives one anyway between 95% - 100% clear skin. Heck, medications and topicals couldm't even give me that. ;-)

I'm intrigued - if it's just sugar and junk food that we need to avoid, in this case, where does the non-high carb/dairy/etc/etc diet (i.e. other foods we need to avoid) come into it? Or is that classed under the title of 'junk food' as well? bb_icon_confused.gif

Thanks. smile.gif

#26 BenKweller

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Posted 19 August 2004 - 01:46 PM

All I know is under those "guidelines" someone who has an allergy processed sugars (and would therefore never even touch them) couldn't possibly get acne... right?

#27 SweetJade1980

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Posted 19 August 2004 - 02:49 PM

QUOTE (cynic @ Aug 19 2004, 01:31 PM)
QUOTE (SweetJade1980 @ Aug 19 2004, 12:10 PM)
Sure.  I KNOW and have POSTED repeatedly the scientific studies to back it up.  I will say it again, for certain individuals, at least 60 among the acne boards that I'm aware of, not to mention those on other chronic health & hormonal disorder boards, that avoidance of such a diet gives one anyway between 95% - 100% clear skin.  Heck, medications and topicals couldm't even give me that.  ;-)

I'm intrigued - if it's just sugar and junk food that we need to avoid, in this case, where does the non-high carb/dairy/etc/etc diet (i.e. other foods we need to avoid) come into it? Or is that classed under the title of 'junk food' as well? bb_icon_confused.gif

Thanks. smile.gif

Defining "Junk" Food and "Healthy" Food among our peers seems to be the bulk of the problem.

In order to understand the way something affects your body, you MUST know how to connect the dots. In order to do that, you MUST have at least a moderate understanding on how foods play a role in hormone & inflammation production.


In general order of production, this is the most simplified way I can show you this:

Sugar ---> Insulin (&/ or IGF-1) ----> Cholesterol


Cholesterol ---> Progesterones ---> Testosterones ---> Estrogens

Notice how you produce Testosterone before Estrogen? Well there's a variety of complications where that Testosterone can skip turning into enough Estrogen in order to be the dominant hormone for both males & females, and as such will be able to convert into it's more active form, known as DHT.

Overproduciton of Insulin encourages Androgen production as it will reduce our bodies ability to produce Sex Hormone Bindng Globulin (SHBG) via Estrogen, which is neccessary in order to bind Free Testosterone. While acne is only but ONE possible symptom, there are dozens of studies that have linked Insulin Resistance Syndrome or HyperInsulinemia to Puberty and Hyperandrogenism!


Carbohyrdates = Sugar so when I speak I'm referring to them both unless I specify otherwise. Too much (certain) carbohydrates will raise your IGF-1, Insulin, while reducing your ability to produce SHBG, IGFBP-3 (binds IGF-1), PGE2 Prostaglandins (anti-inflammatory), fight infections, fight inflammation, and encourage sugar loving bacteria (mouth or gut) & yeast growth.
*Usually most Fruits and Vegetables are excluded from this list, due to fiber content.


Excess Sugars and/or Fats = Fats in the body, which we can use to become overweight and/or to produce more androgen hormones, among other possibilities. This includes Trans Fats, certain Saturated fats and Fructose. High Fructose Corn Syrup is form of sugar that doesn't affect blood sugar, but still raises cholesterol levels in the body. Whereas regular sugar, aka Glucose, raises both your blood sugar and your cholesterol levels if you overconsume it. These fats & sugars will also raise your IGF-1 and your PGE1 Prostaglandins (inflammatory) levels.


Dairy = Sugar, Fat, Added IGF-1 Hormone, and problematic Glycoproteins for those that are allergic or intolerant. Sure it helps with certain cancers & wieght loss, but if you read the studies, that's because of it's calcium content. You want calcium? There's PLENTY of other ways to obtain it naturally and recieve those same health benefits and then some.


There are a variety of effective diets out there, some of which are similar to Low-Carb type diets, but deal more so with Allergies and Intolerances. Due to acne being so multifacted, sometimes we combine these diets in order to find the right one for us. However, if you are wondering SPECIFICALLY about the Sugar-Acne Connection, what I've found through 100s of hours of research, experimenting, and others testimonies is that it's not just about avoiding sugar but also fats. They both play a role in hormone and inflammation production and if you want to attack acne at all angles through this dietary aspect, then you must reduce/eliminate certain forms of both of these.

Sometimes eliminating a few foods is enough to get people 100% clear, other times, depending on what they are avoiding, it is less effective. It really depends on whether one is following the right diet for their problem, how dedicated one is at following their dietary changes, and how stubborn their problems are. If one finds that they are eliminating "too many" foods, then they should try to add something to offset that. If it turns out that diet alone isn't enough, then absolutely one should try detoxing (aka, flush, cleanse, etc), using the appropriate supplements, and /or medications if need be.

Still confused? ;-)

#28 Sam The Man

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Posted 19 August 2004 - 03:24 PM

Here is some stuff of nutrition and hormones from Volek, who is pretty respected guy from what I've heard. It seems to say that high-fat meals decrease total and free testosterone levels. But it also states that studies have shown that acute elevations in insulin do not affect total or free testosterone levels in healthy normal normal weight men or women. Of course I don't know what they consider to be a healthy person. smile.gif

#29 Denise2

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Posted 19 August 2004 - 03:24 PM

World famous dermatologist Dr. Perricone wrote a book on the acne/diet connection. I cannot believe that this is even open for discussion.

Dr. Perricone's book on acne has before/after pics, as well as a lot of scientific evidence pointing to the connection between diet and acne.

If you believe that the famous, brilliant, Dr. Perricone doesn't know what he's talking about, then please provide a more sensible hypothesis about what causes acne.

#30 SweetJade1980

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Posted 19 August 2004 - 03:37 PM

Denise, according to what he said in some other post, Ben doesn't believe in at least, Perricone's views on this.

I was skimming through his book the other night and he says that he hopes more doctors will investigate the effects of cytokines in what they define as "pre-inflammatory" acne, instead of only focusing on what they define as inflammatory or cystic acne. He believes that all acne is inflammatory and even explains his reasons so.

#31 Sam The Man

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Posted 19 August 2004 - 03:40 PM

QUOTE (Denise2 @ Aug 20 2004, 12:11 AM)
If you believe that the famous, brilliant, Dr. Perricone doesn't know what he's talking about, then please provide a more sensible hypothesis about what causes acne.

Androgens. We produce them even if we don't eat anything.
I think that the question is if diet can affect hormones enough to "cause" acne. From my experiences my own acne is not triggered by diet. So that probably means that my skin is so sensitive to androgen influence that the hormonal effects that diet has on my androgen production is not enough to affect the sebum production in my face.

In that link Volek doesn't say anything about SHBG or did I just miss that part?

#32 SweetJade1980

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Posted 19 August 2004 - 04:15 PM

Sam,
Hey thanks for posting that article. I'm really interested in learning how one can work the system in order to gain wieght or build muscle mass while still following an acne diet of some sort. ;-)

Bear in mind though that this is studying those that lift wieghts or work out, which the average person doesn't do to such an extent as body builders do.

QUOTE
"To date, the majority of research has concentrated on providing carbohydrate alone or combined with protein before or after resistance exercise. Carbohydrate and protein intake significantly alters circulating metabolites and the hormonal milieu (i.e., insulin, testosterone, growth hormone, and cortisol), as well as the response of muscle protein and glycogen balance."



QUOTE
Hormones regulate nearly every physiological process in
the body. Metabolically, hormones regulate the synthesis
and breakdown of proteins, carbohydrates, and lipids. Thus,
hormones play an integral role in regulating genes, coordinating
fuel selection and partitioning nutrients, which over
time impacts lean and adipose tissue. The impact of hormones
in mediating the effects of nutrition on acute and
chronic responses to resistance exercise is poorly understood
and requires further investigation at the cellular level
where the signal at the receptor and gene level initiates the
cascade of events leading to protein accretion. A first point
of understanding is how nutritional intake affects postprandial
and particularly resistance exercise-induced hormones
such as insulin, growth hormone (GH), insulin-like growth
factor-I (IGF-I), testosterone, and cortisol because these
hormones have major regulatory roles in protein, carbohydrate,
and lipid metabolism.


Insulin. In terms of carbohydrate and protein metabolism,
insulin promotes glucose uptake, glycogen formation,
and protein synthesis in the presence of sufficient
amino acids. Carbohydrate ingestion results in elevated
insulin levels that depend to some extent on the glycemic
effect of the food. Certain amino acids can increase
insulin
and thus there has been some interest in combining
protein with carbohydrate to maximize insulin secretion
in the hopes of enhancing postexercise glycogen
resynthesis (63,64,68) and protein anabolism (45,58).


Although the effects of carbohydrate combined with protein
on glycogen resynthesis after resistance exercise is
unknown, there does appear to be a beneficial effect of
ingesting some protein and/or amino acids in combination
with carbohydrate on glycogen resynthesis after submaximal
cycling exercise compared with the same
amount of carbohydrate only (63,68). This effect is likely
due to greater insulin secretion after combined carbohydrate
and protein intake although it is pointed out that
when carbohydrate intake is very high (1.2 g·kg1·h1),
additional protein does not further enhance the rate of
glycogen resynthesis (28). Enhanced insulin levels resulting
from carbohydrate combined with protein could be
expected to have a favorable effect on net protein balance
because insulin is generally accepted as a stimulator of
protein synthesis only when adequate amino acids are
available (32).


QUOTE

Testosterone has potent anabolic effects
on muscle tissue. Total and free testosterone were
not affected after a low-fat meal (1% fat, 26% protein,
73% carbohydrate) but were significantly reduced by
30% after an isocaloric high-fat meal (57% fat, 9%
protein, 34% carbohydrate) in healthy men (41).......

Collectively, these studies indicate that feeding decreases circulating
testosterone and the composition of meals, particularly
the amount and type of fat, influence postprandial testosterone
levels. Insulin and testosterone tend to exhibit
an inverse relation in the above studies; however, findings
from studies using the euglycemic hyperinsulinemic
clamp procedure have shown that acute elevations in
insulin do not affect total or free testosterone levels in
healthy normal-weight men (13,44) or women (12).


Notice it's low in Carbs? Notice that they mention amount & types of fat? If you work hard enough, you can definately burn that much fat for energy and so it probably wouldn't contribute to excess hormone producton. Not to mention, there's not enough stimulation for Insulin production to boost the body's ability to overproduce testosterone.


QUOTE
Although there have been some enlightening studies on the role of insulin in mediating responses to diet and exercise interventions, the influence of
other hormones (e.g., GH, IGF-I, testosterone, cortisol) that
have potent effects on carbohydrate, protein, and lipid balance
remain unclear. Future studies should consider how the
entire hormonal milieu responds to different diet and exercise
configurations with an emphasis on target tissue effects.
Because most studies are focused on a single outcome (e.g.,
protein balance, glycogen resynthesis, body composition,
etc.), one challenge in the future will be to integrate the
findings from these varying perspectives into a unified
model.


Unfortunately though long-term acne sufferers are not "normal" when it comes to the way our skin and bodies respond to things. Due to some sort of gene-environment abnormality, our bodies do one or more of the following:

underproduce thyroid hormone

overproduce or underproduce cortisol (stress hormone)

overproduce insulin

produce too much testosterone

increase sensitivity to normal amounts of testosterone

have trouble eliminating the normal/excess amounts of hormones

have trouble eliminating other toxins

have allergies that boost inflammation acne

have intolerances that boost inflammation acne

have poor digestion which can boost yeast, bacteria or intolerances

have trouble metabolizing fats

have bowel irregularites

......among other possibile defects


This is why there are many different natural & dietary solutions. I suppose this is why some people like to believe there is no connection, because there isn't always a specific diet for a specific problem or symptom.

#33 SweetJade1980

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Posted 19 August 2004 - 04:18 PM

Sam,
Yeah Volek mentions SHBG, but he doesn't study it's role in this article. Dr. Perricone mentions for the sake of simplcity, "hormones" instead of going into my usual speal as to what hormones are produced, and why, etc ;-)


QUOTE
All steroids are derived from enzyme breakdown of cholesterol. Androgens are sex steroids which structurally have 19 carbons. There are 7 total androgens: dehydroepiandrosterone (DHEA), delta 5 androstenediol, androsterone, delta 5 androstanediol, delta 4 androstendione, testosterone and dihydrotestosterone. The other sex steroids are estrogens with 18 carbons.


Androgens are synthesized in the:gonad (ovary or testicle) from cholesterol; adrenal gland from cholesterol and periphery from DHEA. Androgens are as natural to women as are estrogens. Androgens have actions on multiple areas of the body including bone, muscle, skin, liver, kidney, brain, immune system, bone marrow and genital organs. Contemporary evidence is accumulating from animal/human studies that androgens are critical for male and female sexual function - desire, arousal, orgasm function. The exact mechanism of action of androgens on the body may involve synthesis of critical sex steroid dependent proteins or growth factors which act on the nerves, arteries, smooth muscles and connective tissue of the genitals maintaining structure and function.

Androgen values consistently decrease with age in both genders. By age 40 - 50, men and women have less than half of the DHEA and testosterone they had at age 20 years. Andorgen insufficiency: can be Gonadal (chemo- or radiation-therapy, oophorectomy), Adrenal (adrenal failure or insufficiency), Hypothalamic-Pituitary (hypopituitarism), Drug-Related (corticosteroids, anti-androgenic agents, oral contraceptive pill, oral estrogen therapies) and Idiopathic (age-related). It may indicate or be related to other medical, psychiatric or psychosocial factors such as (i) a major life stress or relationship conflict (ii) thyroid disease, (iii) major metabolic/nutritional disorders or other causes of chronic fatigue, psychiatric disorders such as major depressive disorder, or other conditions or factors.
SHBG (sex hormone binding globulin) is elevated in many of these syndromes.

Free testosterone is equal to the total testosterone divided by the free testosterone. In patients with elevated SHBG values, total testosterone values have to be elevated to even higher values, so that free testosterone values are adequate. Production of SHBG is highly estrogen sensitive: oral intake of estrogen results in a profound dose-dependant INCREASE in SHBG. Conditions in women where androgen values are associated with decreased activity of critical enzymes include sexual dysfunction after childbirth and sexual dysfunction associated with the transition and the menopause. Oral contraceptives are associated with decreased ovarian synthesis of testosterone and increased synthesis of SHBG. In women, estrogen medications are associated with increased synthesis of SHBG. In women, lupron, zoladex medications are associated with decreased ovarian synthesis of testosterone. http://www.bumc.bu.e...epartmentID=371



I'm not certain, but if you don't produce cholesterol, you wouldn't produce androgens either. Yet, since we are always eating something that will convert to or increase cholesterol, that's not quite the answer ;-) Of course if you want to reduce or eliminate acne, those are the ways you would produce anti-androgenic affects, among dietary changes.

#34 bestscreennameever

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Posted 20 August 2004 - 07:26 AM

When your thyroid doesn't produce enough hormone, you have hypothyroidism. I was diagnosed with it once. Out of curiosity, I tried looking up any links between this and acne.

On the following page

http://www.wholeheal...ns/thyroid2.htm

it says that those with hypothyroidism should eat plenty of iodine-containing foods. Don't many people believe, though, that iodine may contribute to acne?

#35 SweetJade1980

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Posted 20 August 2004 - 01:20 PM

Holly,
Yeah people tend to believe that because if you get TOO MUCH Iodine in your system it can aggravate skin conditions. However, the regular amounts we get from foods generally shouldn't be a problem as they don't reach such levels. So that's one thing I don't "stress" about, but everyone's sensitivity levels are different.

So logically one would think that it's hyperthyroidism that would cause this, but it's generally those that are Hypothyroid that have acne. If you are Hypothyroid, you obviously don't make enough, so the too much iodine theory wouldn't affect you. However, those that are Hypothyroid, don't produce enough Sex Hormone Binding Globulin (SHBG), which is responsible for trapping that excess or Free Testosterone. That's at least one way, it's linked to acne.


Not quite related, but here's something scary, although if you belief in the overproliferative (growth) Cancerous effects of IGF-1 it makes sense!


QUOTE
Int J Epidemiol. 1993 Dec;22(6):1000-9.  Related Articles, Links 


Erratum in:
Int J Epidemiol 1994 Dec;23(6):1330.

The influence of medical conditions associated with hormones on the risk of breast cancer.

Moseson M, Koenig KL, Shore RE, Pasternack BS.

Department of Environmental Medicine, NYU Medical Center, NY 10010-2598.

Medical conditions related to hormonal abnormalities were investigated in a case-control study of breast cancer among women who attended a screening centre. Information was obtained by telephone interview regarding physician-diagnosed medical conditions such as thyroid or liver diseases, diabetes, and hypertension, as well as hirsutism, acne, galactorrhoea, and reproductive, menstrual, and gynaecological factors. Results are presented for 354 cases and 747 controls. Women with fertility problems who never succeeded in becoming pregnant were at significantly increased breast cancer risk (adjusted odds ratio [OR] = 3.5; 95% confidence interval [CI]:1.1-10.9). An elevated cancer risk was also associated with having excess body hair (OR = 1.5; 95% CI:1.0-2.3), or having excess body hair in addition to persistent adult acne (OR = 6.8; 95% CI:1.7-27.1). Recurrent amenorrhea (OR = 3.5; 95% CI:1.1-11.5), and a treated hyperthyroid condition (OR = 2.2; 95% CI:1.1-4.4) were significantly associated with risk. A non-significant elevation of risk was present for endometrial hyperplasia (OR = 1.8; 95% CI: 0.8-4.0). There was a suggestion of an association between a history of galactorrhoea and breast cancer risk (OR = 2.0; 95% CI:0.8-4.9) among premenopausal women. No associations were found with other medical or gynaecological factors. The possibility that some of these findings are due to chance cannot be excluded because of the problem of multiple comparisons.

http://www.ncbi.nlm....st_uids=8144280



Here's one that's more related:

QUOTE
Am J Clin Dermatol. 2003;4(5):315-31.  Related Articles, Links 


Cutaneous manifestations of endocrine disorders: a guide for dermatologists.
Jabbour SA.

Division of Endocrinology, Diabetes and Metabolism, Thomas Jefferson University, Philadelphia, Pennsylvania 19107, USA. serge.jabbour@mail.tju.edu

Dermatologists may commonly see skin lesions that reflect an underlying endocrine disorder. Identifying the endocrinopathy is very important, so that patients can receive corrective rather than symptomatic treatment. Skin diseases with underlying endocrine pathology include: thyrotoxicosis; hypothyroidism; Cushing syndrome; Addison disease; acromegaly; hyperandrogenism; hypopituitarism; primary hyperparathyroidism; hypoparathyroidism; pseudohypoparathyroidism and manifestations of diabetes mellitus.

Thyrotoxicosis may lead to multiple cutaneous manifestations, including hair loss, pretibial myxedema, onycholysis and acropachy. In patients with hypothyroidism, there is hair loss, the skin is cold and pale, with myxedematous changes, mainly in the hands and in the periorbital region.The striking features of Cushing syndrome are centripetal obesity, moon facies, buffalo hump, supraclavicular fat pads, and abdominal striae. In Addison disease, the skin is hyperpigmented, mostly on the face, neck and back of the hands.Virtually all patients with acromegaly have acral and soft tissue overgrowth, with characteristic findings, like macrognathia and enlarged hands and feet. The skin is thickened, and facial features are coarser.

Conditions leading to hyperandrogenism in females present as acne, hirsutism and signs of virilization (temporal balding, clitoromegaly).A prominent feature of hypopituitarism is a pallor of the skin with a yellowish tinge. The skin is also thinner, resulting in fine wrinkling around the eyes and mouth, making the patient look older.Primary hyperparathyroidism is rarely associated with pruritus and chronic urticaria. In hypoparathyroidism, the skin is dry, scaly and puffy. Nails become brittle and hair is coarse and sparse. Pseudohypoparathyroidism may have a special somatic phenotype known as Albright osteodystrophy. This consists of short stature, short neck, brachydactyly and subcutaneous calcifications.Some of the cutaneous manifestations of diabetes mellitus include necrobiosis lipoidica diabeticorum, diabetic dermopathy, scleredema adultorum and acanthosis nigricans.
http://www.ncbi.nlm....t_uids=12688837


This didn't mention acne too often, but the majority of those hormonal disorders, and a few others, can and have had acne as one of the symptoms. Usually you balance the disorder and the acne, etc goes away wink.gif


#36 bestscreennameever

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Posted 20 August 2004 - 01:23 PM

My thyroid was inflamed when I was 14, causing it to produce too much hormone. A year later, I was diagnosed with hypothyroidism. I had acne through both. My acne only cleared up when I got on birth control pills.

That being said, thyroid disorders are much more common in women than in men, and they are also more common the older you are. So if you are an older woman who suffers from acne, for instance, it's definitely something you should have checked.

Edited by holly_lujah, 20 August 2004 - 01:30 PM.


#37 SweetJade1980

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Posted 20 August 2004 - 01:43 PM

Denise,
Something I'm sure you'd appreciate is that Fluride use/consumption can lead to Thyroid problems, along with a few other health & dental problems. Due the amounts that we get not just from our toothpastes, mouthwash, & gum but also our drinking water, we generally consume too much. Fluoride is one of several minerals that can mimic hormones or chemicals in the body. In this case it mimics Thyroid Stimulating Hormone (TSH). Usually, with enough stimulation, you can go from being Hyperthyroid to Hypothyroid. So once again, another reason to want to heavy metal detox ;-)



QUOTE
Zhonghua Liu Xing Bing Xue Za Zhi. 1994 Oct;15(5):296-8.  Related Articles, Links 


[Effects of high iodine and high fluorine on children's intelligence and the metabolism of iodine and fluorine]
[Article in Chinese]

Yang Y, Wang X, Guo X.

Shandong Provincial Institute of Endemic Disease Control, Jinan.

An investigation on children's intelligence and the metabolism of iodine and fluorine in high iodine and fluorine regions was carried out. The results were as follows. In high iodine and high fluorine areas, the thyroid enlargement prevalence rate among inhabitants and that among children were 3.8% and 29.8%, respectively. The dental fluorosis prevalence rate among inhabitants and that among children was 35.48% and 72.9%, respectively. The pupils' average intelligence quotient (IQ) was 76.67 +/- 7.75, slightly lower than the control point, but that of low intelligent pupils was 16.7%. The urinary iodine and urinary fluoride were 816.25 +/- 1.80 micrograms/L and 2.08 +/- 1.03 mg/L, respectively, markedly higher than the control point. The thyroid iodine-131 (131I) uptake rate was markedly lower than the control point. The values at 3 h and 24 h were 9.36 +/- 1.55% and 9.26 +/- 4.63%, respectively. The serum TSH was obviously higher than the control point. These results indicate that high iodine and high fluorine exert severe damage to human body.  http://www.ncbi.nlm....st_uids=7859263



QUOTE
Gig Tr Prof Zabol. 1989;(9):19-22.  Related Articles, Links 


[Chronic effects of fluorides on the pituitary-thyroid system in industrial workers]

[Article in Russian]

Tokar' VI, Voroshnin VV, Sherbakov SV.

Radioimmunologic study of thyrotropin and thyroid hormones in the blood of those engaged in fluorine production showed moderate functional changes of the hypophysis-thyroid gland system, not accompanied by clinical manifestations of hypo- or hyperthyreosis and caused by disorders of the regulatory chain and fluorine impact on thyroid hormones' metabolism at the level of target cells. Elevation of calcitonin concentration in workers' blood indicated stimulation of thyroid gland parafollicular cells. Phase states in the hypophysis-thyroid gland system were detected along with the dependence of some hormones' concentration on the duration of workers' contact with fluorine compounds and the stage of fluorosis.  http://www.ncbi.nlm....st_uids=2612943



QUOTE
Probl Endokrinol (Mosk). 1985 Nov-Dec;31(6):25-9.  Related Articles, Links 


[Action of the body fluorine of healthy persons and thyroidopathy patients on the function of hypophyseal-thyroid the system]

[Article in Russian]

Bachinskii PP, Gutsalenko OA, Naryzhniuk ND, Sidora VD, Shliakhta AI.

Altogether 123 persons were examined: 47 healthy persons, 43 patients with thyroid hyperfunction and 33 with thyroid hypofunction. It was established that prolonged consumption of drinking water with a raised fluorine content (122 +/- 5 mumol/l with the normal value of 52 +/- 5 mumol/l) by healthy persons caused tension of function of the pituitary-thyroid system that was expressed in TSH elevated production, a decrease in the T3 concentration and more intense absorption of radioactive iodine by the thyroid as compared to healthy persons who consumed drinking water with the normal fluorine concentration. The results led to a conclusion that excess of fluorine in drinking water was a risk factor of more rapid development of thyroid pathology. Indicators of the fluorine content in daily urine provide most of the information on changes of the fluorine amount in the body. http://www.ncbi.nlm....st_uids=4088985

#38 SweetJade1980

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Posted 20 August 2004 - 01:49 PM

QUOTE (holly_lujah @ Aug 20 2004, 01:10 PM)
My thyroid was inflamed when I was 14, causing it to produce too much hormone.  A year later, I was diagnosed with hypothyroidism.  I had acne through both.  My acne only cleared up when I got on birth control pills.

That being said, thyroid disorders are much more common in women than in men, and they are also more common the older you are.  So if you are an older woman who suffers from acne, for instance, it's definitely something you should have checked.

Yeah, you were 14 and Hyperthyroid and then 15 and Hypothyroid, but at the same time you were still going through puberty, so that may explain why you had acne during both periods. Then again, there are people that are hyperthyroid that have acne, but usually those diagnosed on these acne boards, turn out to be Hypothyroid.

I can completely understand how you feel about the meds. I was on meds too for my disorder, including birth control, and none of that cleared me or fixed all of my symptoms I guess that's why we are here biggrin.gif

#39 Ben16

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Posted 24 August 2004 - 10:44 AM

Hey guys, so okay times up no more escaping.Doing the liver cleanse tomorrow. Just got a question.

QUOTE
Try to take either a hot bath or jog on Saturday to stimulate your liver. At night when your going to sleep try to apply a hot water pack to your liver area.


When shall I go jogging? Morning, afternoon? Evening?

#40 BenKweller

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Posted 24 August 2004 - 12:45 PM

I don't see why you'd want to do it -- if a 16 year old has a really clogged liver, I doubt you'd live past 30. But have fun.