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#41 marti783

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Posted 21 February 2010 - 01:45 PM

yea seriously, if the paleo diet can improve if not eliminate severe acne, than i really think we're all in for a great experience. i have mild-moderate acne. i tend to breakout in cycles all around my chin and jawline and it has been very stubborn ever since i was in highschool (i'm out of college now).

i checked the ingredients and everything seems okay except for the sodium, like you said. there is alot in it. luckily i still live at home and i'm sure my mom would LOVE the fact that i want to eat home-made sauce (no sarcasm). so maybe she can make some for me. i was thinking of putting it on my grilled chicken maybe. as i said, i'm italian and the hardest part about this diet is giving up pasta. so a little sauce here and there might just satisfy me enough lol

i'm not sure how much is "moderate" drinking to him. i would assume no more than a few drinks a week, if that even. as far as what beverages he suggests, i would assume most liquirs and most wines (just make sure they aren't too sweet). again, only in moderation. just make sure you avoid beer and drink mixes.

i'm probably just gonna stay away from the brazil nuts for now. in his book he says to follow his 30-day plan as strictly as possible and then after 30 days or until you're clear, you can try to add in some foods VERY slowly. like one food a month. he also says that it's okay to give yourself about 8 "open" meals a month where you can eat the foods you've been missing/craving. be careful not to over do it and make sure they're spread out. but most importantly, wait until you're clear! personally, i'm gonna wait until i get clear for AT LEAST a couple of months. i've never been clear for more than a couple weeks so if i can get clear for a couple months i may just think about eating some speghetti or pizza.

#42 venam

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Posted 21 February 2010 - 02:15 PM

Although this obviously is not the same as pasta, if you are look for a substitute try spaghetti squash:

http://k8paleo.blogs...meat-sauce.html

I normally open and bake it, I make my own sauce out of canned peeled tomatoes. Canned is not completely paleo but I do consume canned foods.

Edited by venam, 21 February 2010 - 02:16 PM.


#43 marti783

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Posted 21 February 2010 - 10:35 PM

what are everyone's thoughts on working out. from what i know, it's best to avoid "heavy" workouts in favor of "light" or "mild" but what exactly constitutes a "mild" workout. personally, i've been lazy the last year or so and haven't workedout (i tend to work out for like a year or so then stop then start again). since this paleo diet is going to slim me down some, i was planning on starting to work out again. i plan on working out with less weight and more reps instead of more weight and less reps so i can get nice and toned for the summer. the nice thing about this paleo diet is that my body fat is gonna melt away! (i'm not a big guy either, 5'7 145) i'm assuming that "heavy" workouts are more weight, less reps and "mild" workouts are less weight and more reps. does that sound right?

#44 venam

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Posted 22 February 2010 - 01:12 AM

I would change your workout a bit. Make your strength work shorter and more painful. More weight and less rep, but spend less time lifting. Make you long workouts longer and less painful. Don't jog, walk for longer amount of time. Do sprints and tabata sets. I recommend you do some reading:

http://www.marksdail...t-build-muscle/
http://www.marksdail...i-hate-running/
http://www.marksdail...chronic-cardio/
http://www.marksdail...ronic-cardio-2/
http://www.marksdail...ness-standards/ -> read the other parts within that post
http://www.marksdail...against-cardio/


I know is a lot of reading, I really like Mark's take on evolutionary fitness.

#45 dirtbomb

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Posted 22 February 2010 - 05:15 AM

QUOTE
yea seriously, if the paleo diet can improve if not eliminate severe acne, than i really think we're all in for a great experience.


I totally agree. I honestly don't understand why not more people are interested in it. It's so obvious that it can and often does work. I think the paleo diet is just so much more convincing than all other diets simply because we have living breathing acne-free populations all over the world to point to, like I've already done several times in this thread, haha. People who rant about other diets simply cannot point to "evidence" the way we can. They have books and salesmen on TV for inspiration to keep them going, we have real people (and books!). And by the way, I think Dan scared away lots of people from the paleo diet (if you have no idea what I'm talking about, he basically tried to paleo diet for a couple of months and didn't clear up). In my opinion he should have stayed on it longer. I think I'll try it for at least 6 months. (With some cheating most likely -- the "8 open meals" sounds awesome, by the way. Ha. I think it's a great idea because most people probably only crave a few certain foods, and they don't really need them that often to stay satisfied. Like myself for example -- if I could just have a bag of potato chips a couple of times a month and a large plate of fries it would most likely be A LOT easier for me to stay on the paleo diet and be happy about it.)

I never drink more than a couple of times a month these days, so sticking to his recommendations there shouldn't be a problem for me.

When it comes to working out I find my inspiration in indigenous peoples there too. So I don't do any lifting at the gym or anything like that. I try and get the exercise I need in my daily life (which is hard) by walking a lot, running, swimming when it's warm, climbing, jumping over fences and shit like that, anything that resembles typical daily activities outside civilization really. It's fun. I do sit-ups and things like that a few times a week too though. I have no intention of getting "big", I just wanna feel healthy. And yes, you'll lose body fat. I lost about 5 kilos (11 lb) when I went on the paleo diet (and I was already really thin), then I stayed at that weight. I'm pretty fucking skinny right now but my muscles are more visible and I think if I started working out hard I'd get some pretty cool ones to show off. There's like zero fat on my body right now. Not sure that's a good thing though but I feel like I'm in my "natural" state eating this diet. Lots of human beings are thin by nature and you're not sick or starving because you look this way. 80% of my male friends have tits now and a stomach that's too big and it's just not the way it's supposed to be. Fuck dem carbs.

#46 Naturalis

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Posted 22 February 2010 - 07:23 AM

QUOTE
And by the way, I think Dan scared away lots of people from the paleo diet (if you have no idea what I'm talking about, he basically tried to paleo diet for a couple of months and didn't clear up). In my opinion he should have stayed on it longer. I think I'll try it for at least 6 months.


His version was really high on protein.

I'm also on paleoish diet and too much protein alone was enough to keep me breaking out...

#47 dirtbomb

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Posted 22 February 2010 - 09:09 AM

Protein makes you break out? Never heard that one before. A paleo diet is basically a high-protein, low-carb diet. Maybe it was something specific, like some nut or something, that caused your breakouts rather than protein-rich foods in general?

http://en.wikipedia....wiki/Inuit_diet

#48 dirtbomb

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Posted 22 February 2010 - 09:55 AM

I gotta get Cordain's book, by the way. I think I'm gonna buy The Primal Blueprint eventually as well. Seems like both offer good reads.

#49 CelloIsLove

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Posted 22 February 2010 - 10:23 AM

I have a question:


Normally I have two eggs and a large green smoothie for breakfast. Most sources say to limit eggs to about 4-6 a week, so only two or three days. I need more calories than just a smoothie in the morning, and I can't really afford to buy a lot of meat. What do you suggest I should eat for breakfast (along with my smoothie)?

#50 marti783

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Posted 22 February 2010 - 11:14 AM

thanks for the work out information everyone.

as far as Dan goes, i listened to his interview with Cordain on this website (if you haven't i suggest you do, it's under Acne Info, More Info, Even More Info, then Dr. Interviews). I haven't heard anything about his diet being too high on protein by the way, but i must say, as much as i trust Dan and everything he's done, it sounded a little fishy to me. Basically he went on the diet and saw tremendous results like most people. He was posting his progess online but said some people were saying that the only reason why he saw results was because he was losing weight. Then he said that around the 3 month mark, right around the time he stopped losing weight from the diet, he broke out a little, and since it was right around the holidays he also started breaking from the diet and then broke out severly so went back on the Regimen..or something like that. obviously we know that for most people, it's not about losing weight since alot have been on it for more than 3 months with consistent results. Like I said, as much as I trust Dan and ADMIRE him for what he's done, he needs to sell his products in order for this site to run (without advertisements) so I wouldnt be surprised if he told a little white lie. I also believe that interview probably turned off alot of people from the diet.

dirtbomb- if you get cordain's book you might wanna consider getting the E-Book version for "the dietary cure for acne." Its 10 dollars cheaper AND i found you can search for things so much faster just by typing in a word and having it search for it. Also, consider buying the Dietary Cure for Acne Eating Guide. GREAT book. has EVERYTHING you need and more for meals, meal logs, grocery lists, etc. Those two together are like my bible.

celloislove- if you're eating eggs (which is fine) make sure they are Omega 3 enriched eggs. as far as eating other things, in the Cordains eating guide he lists alot of breakfast meals that have some sort of seafood in them (salmon, shrimp, crab) with some fruit also. I havent tried any so i don't know how it will taste but you should consider something like that to fill you up.

#51 Naturalis

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Posted 22 February 2010 - 11:42 AM

QUOTE
Protein makes you break out? Never heard that one before. A paleo diet is basically a high-protein, low-carb diet. Maybe it was something specific, like some nut or something, that caused your breakouts rather than protein-rich foods in general?


No. I haven't altered my diet at all other than limiting my protein intake.

The reason behind this is that many protein rich foods have high Insulin Index which means that they cause insulin release even though they have very low GI / GL.



#52 dirtbomb

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Posted 22 February 2010 - 11:45 AM

Great post marti.

I listened to like half of that interview. Will check the whole thing later. Something I thought about is that Dan seems to have ignored the classic thing about skin regimens -- that it's normal to go through a period of improvement followed by just the opposite, like a major breakout for instance, then followed by clearing. Isn't that how the Acne.org Regimen works? Isn't that how heavy stuff like Accutane works? Isn't that how the paleo diet (often) works? I think so. And I think Dan should have stayed on it for at least a month longer. I think that if he didn't have the Regimen as a backup, he wouldn't have given up on the paleo diet so quickly. He praised it so much in the beginning, saying things like that he'd never had so much energy before in his life. Just like you I do admire what's he's done for acne sufferers and all, and I actually don't think he's telling any lies here, I just think he really doubts acne can be cured through dietary changes at this point and enjoys his Regimen just way more than the majority of us who're on it. I mean, I'm glad I'm clear for sure, but it's not like I don't mind the fact that I have to do this twice a day to stay that way, that it bleaches my hair and my clothes, that I always look like I've been in the sun with the rest of my clothes on, that I can't really go camping for more than one night, that it costs me a lot of money, etc. Not to diss the Regimen, but I'd rather be clear from a healthy diet. If that's impossible I'll obviously stay on the Regimen until I hopefully grow out of acne, or moderate-severe acne anyway.

Thanks for your recommendation. I was actually gonna get the paper version of the book but now I changed my mind. There's no reason to have it shipped to Europe. I might get the eating guide too as you suggested.

As far as eggs go -- just eat them. I strongly doubt you have to restrict your egg intake the way some people like Cordain suggest. Eggs are extremely healthy and great on the paleo diet. I have 3 a day. If I had more money I'd probably have more like 6 a day. And yes, always get organic ones, they have more omega 3 and are therefore better for you.
Fruit is awesome in the morning. And nuts! Bananas and cashews! Nom nom!!

#53 dirtbomb

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Posted 22 February 2010 - 03:26 PM

Just found an old thread someone dragged up. Check out this guy's results from switching to a paleo-type diet:

http://www.acne.org/...ne-t222897.html

Simply amazing. I find new inspiration every single day now, it's just great. biggrin.gif I'll probably never be able to go back to eating a typical civilized diet full-time after all that I've learnt lately.

Acne update: Pimples on my back are drying up, only 1 out of maybe 7-8 is still red. I'm not saying it's related to my diet, just wanna keep this thread going. You never know though...

Note to self: Get rid of newborn addiction to raisins. biggrin.gif

PS. You guys need to get some groovy avatars. I'm sick of looking at nothing but words!! biggrin.gif


#54 marti783

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Posted 22 February 2010 - 08:33 PM

great stuff. i'm really happy for that guy. i'm actually really getting into this diet. i have a food market right down my street so everytime i go in there it's like heaven. i see all this fresh fish and i start getting all these idea's in my head. i just wish i knew how to cook! and i really think the pimples on your back clearing up is a result of the diet. one of the first things i noticed on my face was how anti-inflammed all of my current acne were. almost like instantly. i think it's because of the balance of omega ratio's. so i wouldn't doubt at all if it was because of the diet man.

also, can someone explain to be probiotics and candida? are they related? what's are your personal experiences with them if any?

and ive been trying to get a picture for my profile for a while now but it doesn't seem to work. it doesn't load! kinda funny thing actually, i was gonna put a picture of tyler durden and i just read your quote at the bottom from fight club. small world!


Edited by marti783, 22 February 2010 - 08:49 PM.


#55 tigermike

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Posted 22 February 2010 - 09:29 PM

QUOTE (CelloIsLove @ Feb 22 2010, 10:23 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I have a question:


Normally I have two eggs and a large green smoothie for breakfast. Most sources say to limit eggs to about 4-6 a week, so only two or three days. I need more calories than just a smoothie in the morning, and I can't really afford to buy a lot of meat. What do you suggest I should eat for breakfast (along with my smoothie)?



more eggs.

or cook some bacon first. bacon is cheap then cook the eggs in the bacon fat leftover.
that plus a green smoothie is plenty of calories.

#56 dirtbomb

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Posted 23 February 2010 - 01:42 AM

Word up tigermike biggrin.gif

#57 dirtbomb

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Posted 23 February 2010 - 01:55 AM

Sounds awesome marti. I love those places. I'm not great at cooking but it's really not that hard once you've gotten into doing it on a daily basis. Just do what seems to make sense or ask your italian mother for advice... hehe. "WHERE'S THAT PASTA SON!!"
If you're getting fish, the easist thing is simply to put a couple of fillets in the oven. I add a small amount of coconout fat to the thing you put the fish in (sorry I can't remember the english word for it... like a pan but you have it in the oven biggrin.gif) so that it doesn't get burned. Not sure that's necessary though.
I have fish every single day, but I'm thinking of getting some omega 3 pills anyway because I'm not sure the fish I'm generally eating is considered the fatty type. I looked at some pills yesterday and they all contained soy and other crappy stuff. Does it matter? The same goes for the zinc pills, I wanna get those too but they contain lots of crap. Still I'm not sure you can actually even MAKE pills without those ingredients. VENAM?? biggrin.gif

It's encouraging to hear you say that, I hope you're right. Sort of waiting for a major breakout though, typically you experience those before things start getting better. Hopefully I can avoid it though. Besides I'm on the Regimen anyway so only my back and/or neck will be affected.

Dude I actually saw your pic of Tyler a few days ago in miniature somewhere... You probably didn't do it right. I'll look into it! You need that avatar...
Did you read the book too (FC)? It's better than the movie. I do enjoy the fact that Brad Pitt has acne scarring though, and is typically considered the most good-looking man alive (those lists are obviously a fucking joke but still).

#58 venam

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Posted 23 February 2010 - 08:42 AM

Hey dirtbomb,

With the pills it is really important you avoid magnesium stearate as an ingredient. It is used for oiling mechanical parts but it gets into everything. To our body it is very inflammatory.

As for fish-oil, there are respectable companies that provide good quality fish oil. Here is one of them:

http://www.vitaminsh....jsp?id=CL-7142 -> capsules but ingredients are OK. I use this, 4 pills a day unless I eat salmon or oily fish.
http://www.vitaminsh....jsp?id=CL-1938 -> liquid, so no other ingredients.

Make sure to keep your fish oil in th fridge as it decomposes/gets rancid quite fast. The reason this happens is because fish oil is mostly poly-unsaturated fats which are the least stable. It should be fine in the fridge. smile.gif

I haven't been able to find a decent zinc supplement, I don't recommend the one I am currently taking (vtiamin shoppe brand). If you find a good one let me know.

#59 dirtbomb

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Posted 23 February 2010 - 10:41 AM

Yo venam, thought your were someone else there for a minute! Nice avatar! biggrin.gif There's some other person on the holistic health forums with a flag too...

Thanks for your post. I'll be very careful about which pills I'm getting, thanks for sharing those advice. As I'm not american it might be hard for us to exchange advice on good brands, stores, etc though. I honestly really hate he thought of having to import something that small unless shipping to Europe is very cheap. Might be possible to find some of the american brands here though, or in a UK webstore or something (generally cheaper to get stuff from there)

What do you think of the Primal Blueprint Dude's own products? I think he has some fish pills and stuff...

#60 marti783

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Posted 23 February 2010 - 01:52 PM

I take one 50 mg zince after breakfast and two fish oil pills twice a day (2 after lunch, 2 after dinner). both are made by "natures bounty." i looked at my zinc and it does contain magnesium stearate in the ingredients. venam where did you hear that magnesium stearate causes inflammation? also, my fish oil contains magnesium silicate. does that sound alright? besides that stuff though, nature's bounty seems good. neither contain soy, gluten, wheat etc etc.