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AMVC spontaneous scarring

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#41 PraisethelordforacneNOT

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Posted 23 February 2010 - 03:10 PM

Lamarr, does these scar respond well to needling? And also I did buy histamine today, but they didn't have any 24hour kind, but they said the histamined worked 24 hour. Lamarr..Have you gotten ridd of these amvc scars? Does it look perfectly smooth these days when you look at your skin under bright light where the amvc scars has been?

The salad kind I have eaten a lot latly is spinach! Which seems to contain a lot of vitamin a and omega-3 fatty acids.

#42 goodlife

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Posted 23 February 2010 - 06:33 PM

I have talked too Lamarr for a while so I can answer your questions in case he doesn't get back to you soon.

The scars respond well to needling, if you look in the thread ' ok guys ' started by lamarr, you will see he has great skin.

Don't worry too much about food, it's the supplements that can cause the problems.

Get the piriton anti histamine if you can. I took them for about a week and the scarring seems to have stopped now.

Edited by goodlife, 23 February 2010 - 06:34 PM.

I am blessed to be the way I am, for God doesn't look at any appearance but rather look unto thy heart.

#43 sportsguy23

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Posted 23 February 2010 - 09:10 PM

I don't know much about needling...so I can't say anything about it...however,

I do think that knowing how the skin works and how small doses of fish oil usually come in. I just don't see the possibility of fish oil with a previous accutane/topical retinoid history could cause spontaneous scarring.

Now, you may have scars underneath your skin that weren't showing before and something else brought them to the surface...however I just doubt that fish oil could do that.

What you should know is accutane patients are more susceptible to scarring during an accutane course and for a certain period after the accutane course.

It changes your skin to an extent.

#44 PraisethelordforacneNOT

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Posted 24 February 2010 - 02:53 AM

Ok, thanks Goodlife! Well Im not sure about the supplements, because I do eat A LOT of vitamin A and omega 3 fatty acid in my diet. Im going to stop eating my multivitamin for a while. Im starting to think perhaps dermarolling makes you more prone to AMVC? Any possibility of this? Just had a dermarolling sessions 4 weeks ago. The antihistamine you mentioned, do you know of a good online store to buy it from? This site trustworthy? http://www.chemistdi...ts_1_26301.html

Well sportsguy23 I stopped Accutane about 1 and half year ago, so that cant be correct.

#45 goodlife

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Posted 24 February 2010 - 09:02 AM

I have never done dermarolling.

I don't know about the website, but you should be able to get the piriton from any chemist. If the multivitamin has high vitamin a then that could be the problem, I noticed the scarring after I took a cod liver oil multivitamin.
I am blessed to be the way I am, for God doesn't look at any appearance but rather look unto thy heart.

#46 PraisethelordforacneNOT

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Posted 24 February 2010 - 01:58 PM

QUOTE (goodlife @ Feb 24 2010, 10:02 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I have never done dermarolling.

I don't know about the website, but you should be able to get the piriton from any chemist. If the multivitamin has high vitamin a then that could be the problem, I noticed the scarring after I took a cod liver oil multivitamin.


Well I'm from Sweden, so it's not that easy. The multivitamin has 100% vit A, of what a person need per day

Edited by PraisethelordforacneNOT, 24 February 2010 - 03:12 PM.


#47 goodlife

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Posted 24 February 2010 - 04:53 PM

The one you posted is the one I took. I got mine from a chemist so I don't know about ordering it online.
I am blessed to be the way I am, for God doesn't look at any appearance but rather look unto thy heart.

#48 Mr President

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Posted 24 February 2010 - 05:47 PM

.

Edited by Mr President, 05 March 2011 - 07:06 PM.


#49 lamarr1986

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Posted 25 February 2010 - 06:24 AM

QUOTE (PraisethelordforacneNOT @ Feb 24 2010, 08:53 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Ok, thanks Goodlife! Well Im not sure about the supplements, because I do eat A LOT of vitamin A and omega 3 fatty acid in my diet. Im going to stop eating my multivitamin for a while. Im starting to think perhaps dermarolling makes you more prone to AMVC? Any possibility of this? Just had a dermarolling sessions 4 weeks ago. The antihistamine you mentioned, do you know of a good online store to buy it from? This site trustworthy? http://www.chemistdi...ts_1_26301.html

Well sportsguy23 I stopped Accutane about 1 and half year ago, so that cant be correct.



Chemist direct are good. You can trust them. Priton works well for me, i didn't want to recommend a brand on this thread as i may look as if i have shares in pfizer or some shit lol.

#50 goodlife

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Posted 25 February 2010 - 08:14 AM

QUOTE (cartwheeling_monkey @ Feb 24 2010, 05:47 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE (goodlife @ Feb 25 2010, 09:53 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
The one you posted is the one I took. I got mine from a chemist so I don't know about ordering it online.


i cant help but think this is kinda a breakthrough. do you think those who are on accutane and take these will have reduced scarring too? i know a lot of people currently get a lot of scarring whilst on accutane.


I don't know, but when I started taking cod liver oil these scars started to appear. They may have been only a few reported cases, but how many people do you think there are with this who don't know what it is. A lot of the scars are very shallow and you may not notice them unless you look very closely, and like a lot of us we look at our skin closely every day.

I am blessed to be the way I am, for God doesn't look at any appearance but rather look unto thy heart.

#51 s.m.

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Posted 25 February 2010 - 08:51 AM

hahahah oh noes accutane is evil !!



Did you even read the study you posted ? god damn scare tactics giving a damn good drug with more positive results then negative a bad name.

you should be ashamed of yourself i hope your little post doesn't shy ppl away from a wonderful drug that has clear millions of people world wide



from the study YOU POSTED


AND I QUOTE !
QUOTE
Based on a pedigree assembled by Qu et al2 and reported in 2005, they suggested that AMVC is of autosomal dominant inheritance.


QUOTE
Because Atrophia maculosa varioliformis cutis can run in families, physical examination of family members may be helpful to rule out a familial disorder and discover other family members with the disease.


QUOTE
No definitive cause has been established for atrophia maculosa varioliformis cutis (AMVC), although skin biopsy specimens for histologic and ultrastructural studies suggest an underlying elastic tissue disorder. Familial cases of AMVC have also been documented.5,6,7 The few associated findings noted were extrahepatic biliary disease8 and pachydermodactyly.9



HOW DARE YOU BLAME THE DRUG ACCUTANE OR EVEN COD LIVER OIL FOR YOUR "SPONTANEOUS SCARRING"
WHY DONT YOU GO BLAME YOUR GENES ! !!!!!!!! NO WHERE IN THAT STUDY DOES IT MENTION EVEN ONCE ISOTRENOIN !!! ARGH


p.s. sorry for the spelling and punctuation errors i needed to reply to this quick as it really got me PISSED

Edited by s.m., 25 February 2010 - 08:53 AM.


#52 goodlife

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Posted 25 February 2010 - 09:23 AM

When you have scars appearing in from of your eyes from areas of your face that haven't broken out for years then come and tell me how pissed you feel.




I am blessed to be the way I am, for God doesn't look at any appearance but rather look unto thy heart.

#53 lamarr1986

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Posted 25 February 2010 - 06:00 PM

QUOTE (s.m. @ Feb 25 2010, 02:51 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
hahahah oh noes accutane is evil !!



Did you even read the study you posted ? god damn scare tactics giving a damn good drug with more positive results then negative a bad name.

you should be ashamed of yourself i hope your little post doesn't shy ppl away from a wonderful drug that has clear millions of people world wide



from the study YOU POSTED


AND I QUOTE !
QUOTE
Based on a pedigree assembled by Qu et al2 and reported in 2005, they suggested that AMVC is of autosomal dominant inheritance.


QUOTE
Because Atrophia maculosa varioliformis cutis can run in families, physical examination of family members may be helpful to rule out a familial disorder and discover other family members with the disease.


QUOTE
No definitive cause has been established for atrophia maculosa varioliformis cutis (AMVC), although skin biopsy specimens for histologic and ultrastructural studies suggest an underlying elastic tissue disorder. Familial cases of AMVC have also been documented.5,6,7 The few associated findings noted were extrahepatic biliary disease8 and pachydermodactyly.9



HOW DARE YOU BLAME THE DRUG ACCUTANE OR EVEN COD LIVER OIL FOR YOUR "SPONTANEOUS SCARRING"
WHY DONT YOU GO BLAME YOUR GENES ! !!!!!!!! NO WHERE IN THAT STUDY DOES IT MENTION EVEN ONCE ISOTRENOIN !!! ARGH


p.s. sorry for the spelling and punctuation errors i needed to reply to this quick as it really got me PISSED


Do you realise accutane alters DNA transcription? Why do you think it reduces sebum output permanently in some people? It is an ANTI CANCER drug. Look it up. The effects aren't limited to the skin, hence the huge list of side effects. Even crosses the blood brain barrier readily.

Edited by lamarr1986, 25 February 2010 - 06:04 PM.


#54 Dave99

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Posted 25 February 2010 - 06:17 PM

No doubt, accutane is a powerful drug. One that would be best left alone, unless absolutely needed. But I have seen no official evidence that it scars a face more. That seems sort of counterproductive, and considering how fast lawyers are willing to to start class action suits these days... I'm pretty sure we would have been hearing about it all over the place if there was really any proof of that happening. I don't know why numerous people are convinced it has done this. I just think they really can't see their face fully until it's clear, and then they see the scars. I'm not a scientist, but I also have a very hard time believing that something as basic as cod liver oil could possibly alter skin in a physical manner, or in such a short period of time. Very few things in nature happen that rapidly. Look at all the people who abuse alcohol, drugs and all kind of harmful things... It takes years of constantly being inundated with a substance to see actual physical evidence of damage.

Edited by Dave99, 26 February 2010 - 03:35 AM.


#55 Mr President

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Posted 25 February 2010 - 06:26 PM

.

Edited by Mr President, 05 March 2011 - 07:07 PM.


#56 sportsguy23

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Posted 26 February 2010 - 02:00 PM

Accutane causes scarring by:

increasing acne breakouts...causing scabbing...and prolonged acne on the face.

Usually it will make it significantly worse before it gets better.

That combined with the prolonged lesions or cysts on the face will cause scarring most likely.

Some people scar easier than others, however.

Other than that it is possible that afterwards accutane makes skin more sensitive to scarring. That may or may not be true.

I think there is a good chance it is somewhat true.

However the odds of an internal supplement helping your scarring or making it worse are just too outlandish to me.

Also the unsubstantiated claims of fish oil. So basically by your logic you should not eat fish. Ever or foods that have omega fatty acids or foods that are high in Vitamin A.


The skin has multiple layers and overtime those layers as well as the amount of collagen can and does change. Just the way it is.

#57 Mr President

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Posted 26 February 2010 - 05:09 PM

.

Edited by Mr President, 05 March 2011 - 07:07 PM.


#58 lamarr1986

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Posted 26 February 2010 - 06:04 PM

Accutane is known to cause delayed wound healing (hence the hyperpigmentation and atrophic scarring) when the wound healing time is increased (due mostly in part to increase inflammation) you end up with scarring and/or hyperpigmentation. Both of which are much more likely whilst on accutane and if a person is effected by accutane strongly enough, their wound healing can be forever impaired.

I for one experience this aswell, due to accutane. I didn't have ANY scarring before i was on tane.

Edited by lamarr1986, 26 February 2010 - 06:04 PM.


#59 sportsguy23

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Posted 01 March 2010 - 09:58 AM

I'm pretty sure I didn't have any scarring before on accutane either.

Also I have a couple lesions on my shoulders...my shoulders broke out badly during accutane then...scabbed up and healed.

What happenes was on my shoulders the area that scabbed up and healed caused a couple minor like keloids basically look like tiny bubble like things...and are here to stay.

Accutane made me breakout worse than i ever had in my life during hte first 1-2 months while on it...and the acne didn't go away until month 3 or so...so basically I had bad acne/scabbing on my face during that time period and that caused my scarring.

I wish I knew as much as I did about skin and regiments now when I was younger...didn't really know how to take care of my skin the correct way and build an effective regimen. THe doctors didn't really effectively tell me how to use the products they prescribed ultimately leading my way to go on accutane.

I guess past is now the past and I cannot sit and worry about whatever is done...I mainly have scarring on my right cheek and it's even harder to treat scarring, let alone can be pricey and result in painful downtime...and risk of even making it worse.


I recommend to you this man:

If you are thinking of accutane.

First try a regimen of tazorac in the evenings and benzaclin the mornings and minocycline twice a day.

Use tazorac in the evenings on dry skin .1% gel.

use benzaclin in the mornings....after you wash your face with a "gentle face wash" like cetaphil gentle...then apply a moisturizer with SPF15.

Then in the evenings shave or do whatever...let your skin dry...then before applying tazorac you can apply a very light moisturizer like Olay oil free or cetaphil moisturizer (i prefer the olay) OR lately I've just been using aloe vera gel after I shave...let it dry...then apply tazorac.


I think a regimen like that would help your acne. Tazorac is what some would say...is accutane for the skin like a topical accutane ...almost...

But that helped me get clear after I started breaking out again a couple years after accutane.

Now my regimen I don't apply anything in mornings anymore. I apply tazorac one night, the next night benzaclin...and I go interchangeably between the two and it is easier on my skin. What I mentioned to you is a rigid and tough routine to adhere to...but it may help you.

#60 freedom

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Posted 01 March 2010 - 04:29 PM

I had this problem with fish oil. Even foods high in 03 would cause it even after stopping the fish oil. The answer for me was to supplement borage and evening primrose. You have to reverse a deficiency of GLA/06. It took me about three months to stop the scarring and 6 months to start to see the scars begin to heal. Scars are 50-80% better now.(and I got these 8 years! ago after taking fish oil for a year) Topical primrose will help hasten this process.

I cant believe how easy it was to turn this problem around once I figured out the cause. Needless suffering! Wish I had never heard about fish oil. Omega 3 can cause problems for those with insulin resistance (which is what a lot of people with acne have!) insulin resistance causes a deficiency with the enzyme that converts 06 to GLA and without GLA you will scar! The fish oil most definitely halted the breakouts and inflammation BUT then I started scaring from even tiny blackheads and simple scratches and those spontaneous scars ugh. And I got seb. dermatitis and other many other health skin problems.

03 eliminates inflammation but without inflammation you will scar. Too much inflammation = scars but also not enough inflammation = scars.

You need a balance of 03 and 06 to create the perfect amount of inflammation and hormonal balance.

.
Took me years to figure it out. Even now I have to avoid 03 sources. Watch out for herbs and teas that reduce eliminate inflammation, they act like 03 in my body and cause scars. (ie green tea, chia seeds, even too many greens like when I tried green smoothies) Take notes when you add any new supplement of food to your diet.

Here is my response to the person who overdosed on cod liver oil/vit A as to why this is happening:
please stop taking the fish oil and other forms of natural vitamin a (foods high in vit A or high in omega 3) This happened to me and I was able to reverse it in three months by stopping all forms of vit. A and omega 3.
MOST IMPORTANT!! is to start taking EVENING PRIMROSE OIL or BORAGE. These are omega 6 rich oils and the opposite of omega 3 oil. These have the activated form of GLA which is 100% necessary to reverse the enzyme deficiencies created by fish oil/vit A/omega 3 excess.

High dose omega 3 oils create a deficiency of omega 6/GLA production which interferes with hormonal production and will many symptoms including hair loss and dry thin skin which is prone to scar. The rash and infection you are seeing are because the skin requires omega 6/GLA in the sebum to prevent infection and irritation. There is plenty of research about this don't take my word for it! This is reversible.

Look up UDo Erasmus, he is the leading researcher of essential fatty acids, these effects happened to him when he took too much flax oil which is high in 03 fatty acids.

When you first start taking EPO/or borage; work your way up to at least 6 (1300mg) capsules a day or more (10% of your calories should be from omega 6 oils) you might experience a break out, worsening of hair fall out, worsening of any current symptoms (i did) but once I got past the first two months I knew I was back on track. Even after a year I still must avoid 03/fish oil, it can take a lot of time to reverse this ESPECIALLY if you have insulin resistance -those with insulin resistance are more prone to deficiencies in
GLA because the enzyme that converts 06 to GLA is defective/slow because of high insulin. This causes a build up or affinity towards 03 and subsequent deficiency in GLA, which is why you must use an 06 supplement with GLA like borage or primrose.

Edited by freedom, 03 March 2010 - 12:23 PM.





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