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Binge eating = High Glycemic Load = Hyperglycemia = Acne

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#1 Rubbish

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Posted 17 September 2008 - 05:57 AM

Binge eating = High Glycemic Load = Hyperglycemia = Acne

So Cordain is partly right, however it does not matter what type of foods you eat, high calorific intake in single sittings will cause acne.

Hunter gatherers around the world have differing diets, look at the Pimas compared to Eskimoes compared to Kitvan Islanders compared to Masai warriors. Their carb to fat to protein ratios all differ form each other yet their calorific intake to calorific needs ratio is way lower relative to westerners.

The Japanese diet before becoming westernized has high GI rice yet they had no acne. Why? Their portion sizes are small. Same with the French Paradox. They eat what is viewed as an unheathy diet yet they exercise portion control and are healthier than the USA.

Stress and infection exacerbate hyerglycemia. So acne feedsback into the situation with the undue stress it causes coupled with the infection.

In eating disorders acne is common. Anorexics are usually non-purging bulimics. So paradoxically they lose weight whilst having acne. As they fast and exercise between binges.

With all these crazy acne diets where certain foods are restricted you will eventually binge, and lo and behold breakout badly just like Dan did.

Evaluate how many calories you need and distribute them evenly over at least 3 meals and preferably 4-5 and your acne will be reduced significantly. Follow the 80-20 rule, 80% healthy and 20% treats and you will be less likely to binge.

Diabetics are told how important portion control is and total calories is now.

Exercise reduces calories and can lower blood glucose, however as diabetics and athletes note intensive exercise can actually cause hyperglycemia as can caffeine.

Anecdotally apple cider vinegar, green tea and vodka are touted as helpful in acne, isn’t it interesting that they all reduce GI of meals. However even these can’t surpress a crazy binge. First and foremost calorie and portion control is essential.

#2 Demorph

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Posted 17 September 2008 - 07:46 AM

+1, i agree with you and the other issue is digestion. that's what i currently think.
i will try eating 6 meals a day with more calories in total than i normally eat in 3 meals per day and see how it goes...

#3 Frenchygirly

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Posted 17 September 2008 - 09:30 AM

Yes I kind of agree. I went to see the doctor today, a specialist in liver matters, and I told him about my experiences with diet and things, and the results are fatigue, boulimia crises (binge eating) and excess weight... he said I was hurting my body way more by trying to eat healthy and then binging cause it's so difficult and I'm so focused and stressed about everything which passes my mouth, than taking diane 35 for the acne. He said I was hurting my liver and my emotional health right now...and my skin is not better. When I was less stressed, it was...I just reazlized it today. So what should I do now? I read so much about diets I'm guilty of eating apples, rice, everything...I am getting mad!

#4 ariellestar1234

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Posted 17 September 2008 - 11:29 AM

I agree totally!
I had 2 suckers yesterday..and almost melted..with happiness..
I know too restricted a diet will cause me to binge..
I need a touch of something sweet every once in a while. wink.gif ..

However,its all about the right calorie intake..and the right porportions..not going overboard.

#5 crevin

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Posted 17 September 2008 - 04:20 PM

This is a VERY interesting idea/post!

I have been doing the holistic approach for almost a year now. I have been tweaking my diet relentlessly. I notice that sometimes I break out when I eat nuts and 'sometimes' I break out from meat and 'sometimes' I break out from dairy...etc etc...

One thing I do know is that I have ALWAYS been a binge eater-- there are times where I just pig out on whatever, whether it be a massive salad or a big slab of meat-- I will eat a ton at one sitting. I've always eaten huge meals and snacked little in between.

Just a week ago, I got two huge painful cysts by my nose-- and all I had eaten for the previous week was raw greens with vegetable oil (lettuce, spring mix, cucumber, broccoli). I had NO sugar going in me, yet I still broke out. I do recall, however, that I'd get off work and go home and eat about 1,000 pounds of greens-- because since it is all healthy, it can't hurt, right? I think there might be a lot more to this 'binge' eating thing... even a huge amount of 'healthy' food might cause a breakout.

I also used to breakout from almond butter and gluten free bread, but I would sometimes sit down and eat 5-6 pieces at one sitting. I reintroduced almond butter/gluten free bread in my diet just yesterday, and was suprised to wake up this morning w/o a change in complexion... I'll let you know in a few days (before I got huge zits immediately).

GREAT post... going to try to snack more often throughout day and not eat huge meals.

Keep the replies coming, people!

#6 crevin

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Posted 17 September 2008 - 04:23 PM

I am going to try eating a piece of almond buttered bread or a 'mini salad' every few hours to stay satisfied, but not gorged and full and see what happens. I am going to stay away from 'meals' persay.

#7 crevin

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Posted 17 September 2008 - 04:36 PM

And I am not saying people don't have food allergies or sensitivities... but SOME food might be tolerable if taken in small amounts for some people (and I know some people will freak at the slightest bit of gluten).

#8 Rubbish

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Posted 18 September 2008 - 07:07 AM

Hi Frenchy, I totally identify, even though as a male.

As a general guideline I would say the rule of a fist full of lean protein (<10% fat), a fist of starchy carbs and up to 4 fists usually 2 of salad such as spinach, lettuce, tomatoes, onions ( very watery stuff ) is good for main meals Breakfast, Lunch and Dinner.

2 Snacks Mid Morning and Mid Afternoon are a piece of fruit or a small can of fruit juice.

This is actually in line with what most Doctors recommend.

I drink green tea and use vinegar dressings.

I will have the odd coffee or diet pepsi and vodka with diet mixers if with friends but this seems to be not a problem.

This is actually a sociable diet as well for instance I will eat white rice just a fistful with a fist of stir fry and green tea. Or a tandoori chicken with a fist of steamed rice. Yes I have introduced the dreaded gluten ( such as noodles or spaghetti) and dairy ( usually cottage cheese ) but portion controlled with no problems. So much for me thinking allergies in the past.

Getting my head around not clearing my plate if overloaded at a restaurant was tough.

I try to keep my daily Glycemic Load roughly around 50, I am not hungry (hypoglycemic) surprisingly and my mood has greatly improved and my skin is not inflamed. Depression, anxiety, inflammation, acne all seem routed in insulin. Whilst fat and protein do not raise glucose in blood like carbs do they do illicit an insulin response, hence I believe portion control is important for these as well. So calorie control and distribution of those throughout day is important.

It is also a good idea to initially keep a food diary and weigh rather than guess what you usually eat. This is what surprised me, I was eating a thousand calories of whole grains in one sitting sometimes. My portion control was wrong.

Having been an anorexic when younger I thought I had recovered and bulimia involved vomiting. I realize now I have been a non-purging bulimic for many many years.




#9 Frenchygirly

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Posted 18 September 2008 - 04:22 PM

I'm real interested by what you say cause I was also anorexic and boulimic (with vomiting) and am back on non purging boulimia now, and I am scared cause though I know it's no good for my skin nor liver nor physical or mental health, I can't stop eating til I am sick and this for a few days now, I think because of all the pressure I've been putting on myself for finding an anti acne diet and reading so many contradictions I grew desperate and don't know what to do.
So you basically eat little portions of evrything? But I guess you avoid sugar and vegetable oil don't you? How can you count your GL?
It's strange cause I always have pain in my muscles and limbs and today I ate sugar and gluten and though I felt heavy because I binged my muscles were real fine for the first time in months!

#10 Rubbish

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Posted 18 September 2008 - 05:40 PM

QUOTE (Frenchygirly @ Sep 18 2008, 05:22 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
So you basically eat little portions of evrything? But I guess you avoid sugar and vegetable oil don't you? How can you count your GL?


I really hate fad diets as ultimately they are a way of getting people to cut calories without knowing it and sell books. So really I am sorry I mentioned GL, it wrongly implies for instance to eat lentils rather than rice, yet the insulin response is pretty similar for all non-processed starch, except potatoes (weirdly, but I have potatoes now). I use GL as a rough reference but ultimately if you eat too many carbohydrates you will cause a huge increase in blood glucose and a similar response with insulin. So a small potato won't overload the insulin response, in fact they being at the top of the satiety index contradicts them acting worse than sugar. Bottom line is excess calories in general be they carbs, protein or fats are bad in my opinion. By excess I mean where the body just cannot cope with the food eaten. Hyperglycemia!

What I am really aiming for is roughly 2000 calories evenly eaten over one day by 3 (400-500 calorie ) meals and 2 (250-300 calorie) snacks. Distributed with about 50% carbs, 25% Protein and 25% fat.

I really think the best system is to roughly use fist sizes, this also correlates with your height and body type for proportionally the right food compared to someone else. So a fist of lean meat/fish/cottage cheese/Eggs, a fist of starch such as potato or rice or spaghetti or a slice of toast. 2 fists of watery salads with tomatoes, spinach, lettuce, onions, but up to 4 fists of watery salad is fine. A piece of fruit for desert is fine if you are still hungry after slowly eating main meal. A teaspoon of olive oil, especially if eating very low fat protein, with salad, and vinegar or mustard on salad is fine as well. Whilst I drink green tea and have vinegar on meals this is by no means to lower glucose levels. Portion and calorie control is the key. NOT starvation either. I also exercise but have cut back to enjoy it rather than lose weight.

It is also important to recognize that you and me don't eat to satisfy hunger. I find it is like a cue seeing a whole box of something it must ALL be finished. That whole loaf of wholegrain bread gone in a night, a whole pack of rolled oats, crazy. Most other people do not do that! When I feel the cue I ask myself why must I finish the whole lot? As you may know this is really cognitive behavior therapy and is used to treat eating disorders as well as regular varied meals of correct proportions. My eating disorders are rooted in my Father constantly criticizing my weight as a child even though he was very fat. I wasn't even that fat looking at old photos. I never say that to my kid and reprimanded my father seriously when I saw him starting on them.


#11 meat_pirate86

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Posted 01 October 2008 - 08:37 PM

Rubbish, I am starting your WOE and I would like to ask you for an example of a typical daily menu. What are the times of day and foods you like? Do you avoid certain foods completely (other than those in your sig.)? Can you usually eat something anywhere (regardless of type of restaurant)? Are there any additives or food chemicals you avoid altogether? Any common pitfalls or advice in general?
Thanks in advance

#12 karma89

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Posted 01 October 2008 - 10:39 PM

Thinking about it, this seems really true for me. I'll wake up, go to class and not eat, then come home and literally sit for 1.5 hours eating. Then, I won't eat again till like 4 hours later, but even then I'll eat a TON of food. Same for dinner. I generally have 3 HUGE meals a day. What is reccomended for gaining weight/bodybuilding, and I guess now for acne as well, is having portioned meals. Lifting sites reccomend about 5-6 meals a day evenly portioned out, and you have to eat atleast 1-2 times your weight in protein.

I'm going to give this system a try, I think diet, sleep and a simple cleaning regimen are all excessively related so lets see where this goes.

#13 AltaPGT

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Posted 01 October 2008 - 11:03 PM

I really think this thread has a lot of heavy hitting information that really rings true, even though most people may not realize it. Thanks Rubbish.

#14 Adam08

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Posted 01 October 2008 - 11:11 PM

I'm going to start putting this into practice. I'm def a binger. I mostly binge on yummy muesli and almonds. This makes a lot of sense. Even when I was on the paleo diet, I binged like crazy!!! I like the idea how i can get same calories by spreading my food into 6 portions! I dont want to lose weight

#15 Parkside

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Posted 01 October 2008 - 11:23 PM

Rubbish, this makes a lot of sense, good post.

Karma89. Two times your weight in protein?! Who recommended that?! You'll kill yourself.

#16 Adam08

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Posted 02 October 2008 - 12:16 AM

just occurred to me that teens prob eat much more than the average human being. especially males

#17 andersoj

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Posted 02 October 2008 - 12:32 AM

I agree with the consensus that this is an important idea and have thought it to be a factor for some time now. I tend to eat two giant meals a day rarely eating breakfast. I honestly eat faster and more than most of the people I'm with and am sure that it isn't good for me, but the problem is that it feels really good and offers me a great release. In this regard I feel like I'm addicted to this style of eating just as I'm addicted other things including coming on this board. For this reason I think it will be very hard for me to refrain, but I know that it would likely do me a lot of good in a lot of ways. Always follow the middle path right? unfortunately moderation just doesn't get me off, but I will try my best. mindfulness meditation has been helping me in this aspect of my life so far and I'll start rigorously applying it to my food smile.gif. Thanks for the inspiration and encouragement.

BTW, How bad was your acne before and how long did it take to clear?

Oh and how do you determine the fat? One Handful of lean meat = 1/2 handful of protein & 1/2 handful of fat?

smile.gif

#18 Rubbish

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Posted 02 October 2008 - 07:49 AM

QUOTE (andersoj @ Oct 2 2008, 01:32 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I agree with the consensus that this is an important idea and have thought it to be a factor for some time now. I tend to eat two giant meals a day rarely eating breakfast. I honestly eat faster and more than most of the people I'm with and am sure that it isn't good for me, but the problem is that it feels really good and offers me a great release. In this regard I feel like I'm addicted to this style of eating just as I'm addicted other things including coming on this board. For this reason I think it will be very hard for me to refrain, but I know that it would likely do me a lot of good in a lot of ways. Always follow the middle path right? unfortunately moderation just doesn't get me off, but I will try my best. mindfulness meditation has been helping me in this aspect of my life so far and I'll start rigorously applying it to my food smile.gif. Thanks for the inspiration and encouragement.

BTW, How bad was your acne before and how long did it take to clear?

Oh and how do you determine the fat? One Handful of lean meat = 1/2 handful of protein & 1/2 handful of fat?

smile.gif


I cleared pretty much in 3 weeks. Although noticeable week by week.

Well pretty much to those who want to know the following, what I usually eat and how do you bodybuild on this diet.

My signature pretty much shows what I typically eat and drink.

I have a read a lot about diabetes, insulin resistance and metabolic syndrome.

The striking thing is that acne sufferers tend to have similar blood work to diabetics.

There is plenty of info on this in pubmed and googling in relation to diabetes and insulin resistance.

Hyperlipidemia...
http://jhs.pharm.or....3(5)/53_596.pdf (This really hit me recently!)
Solution diet low in saturated fat, cholesterol from good low fat sources is not such a bad deal, such as fish.

Hyperglycemia...
Solution portion control (glycemic load) of carbohydrates and fats.

Hyperinsulinemia...
The portion and calorie control of all foods.

I will be honest.
Unfortunately the diabetic diet tries to avoid an anabolic effect so I don't think it is suitable for bulking but it is fine especially in the cutting and maintenance phases. I think for bulking only a minor excess of calories is required and listening to body if hungry and getting plenty of sleep is key, having been a bodybuilder in my early years. So I think even if acne did occur using calorie and portion control but with enough excess to bulk it would be very mild and could easily be controlled with the addition of AHA topicals.

I prefer being athletic and actually look muscular enough even now to be asked what my workout routine is. When I say just push ups and running people who spend hours lifting are puzzled.
Truth is I am very light but very defined because of very low bodyfat. It is an illusion like thin people looking taller than fat people.



#19 Glass Danse

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Posted 02 October 2008 - 07:51 AM

obviously...

#20 Adam08

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Posted 02 October 2008 - 07:01 PM

hey rubbish, what sort of running do you do??

At the moment, I'm doing hill sprints and push ups. Do you do interval training like me or a different type of cardio?

Edit: just read your sig..sweet