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Omega 3, 6, and 9 Fatty Acids

fish oil

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#21 AutonomousOne1980

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Posted 24 February 2007 - 11:38 PM

QUOTE(xxndnromeoxx @ Feb 24 2007, 05:45 PM) View Post
QUOTE(bber @ Feb 24 2007, 05:16 PM) View Post
QUOTE(xxndnromeoxx @ Feb 24 2007, 05:25 PM) View Post
Something else I found

QUOTE

I simply know that it takes 2-4 weeks (maybe more)
for those special fatty acids to replace the 'standard'
original ones in phospholipids of cell membranes and
lead to anti-aggregating & anti-inflammatory effects.
Accordingly, when you stop assuming them in your diet,
those effects persist for a few weeks.
This is what I remember from the first studies in '80s.
Some immediate anti-inflammatory effects after experi-
-mental intravenous administration have been reported.

I should check this 'cause it is just a vague memory...
You could read CLO topic and find other bits and pieces!


Maybe this has something to do with all of this as well, in terms of oil production from irritation as well? I foresee even more results in the next week or two


I've experienced great results with fish oil + resveratrol, since I started them both at the same time I can't tell which one is doing the most but I'd say its the fish oil. Since I started basically 90% of my oil production has decreased, however I am taking doses way higher than what many other people have tried. I'm running 24-28g of fish oil which is about 10g of EPA/DHA a day. See my thread here if interested.
http://www.acne.org/...p...=141074&hl=



That is very interesting, but 24 grams seems way too much, isn't that overdose? Have you found any links as to what can happen if you take that much?




its probably really good for you, and i wouldnt be that worried because youve been overdosing on the bad stuff since the day you were born, you got nothing to lose!!!

#22 acne_battle

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Posted 24 February 2007 - 11:40 PM

I just asked a question

#23 NdnRomeo

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Posted 24 February 2007 - 11:44 PM

QUOTE(OhNoNotAnotherCysticPimple @ Feb 24 2007, 11:25 PM) View Post
I got a question about that. On Friday I purchased Omega 3 Fish oil supplements from GNC (1000 mgs) It says on the bottle to take it once to twice a day. If I took it three times a day is that considered an overdose? Sorry if thats a stupid question but I need to know the answer


If one pill = 1 gram, then you should be fine taking 3. I want to look into how much is the max I can take too


#24 NdnRomeo

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Posted 24 February 2007 - 11:51 PM

Health Risks if overdosed:

* Increased bleeding can occur if overused (normally over 3 grams per day)
* The possibility of hemorrhagic stroke
* Oxidation of omega-3 fatty acids forming biologically active oxidation products
* Increased levels of low density lipoproteins (LDL) cholesterol or apoproteins associated with LDL cholesterol among diabetics and hyperlipidemics
* Reduced glycemic control among diabetics
* Suppression of immune and inflammation responses, and consequently, to decreased resistance to infections and increased susceptibility to opportunistic bacteria


I'm sticking to 3 grams

#25 bber

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Posted 24 February 2007 - 11:53 PM

QUOTE(AutonomousOne1980 @ Feb 25 2007, 12:36 AM) View Post
QUOTE(bber @ Feb 24 2007, 05:16 PM) View Post
QUOTE(xxndnromeoxx @ Feb 24 2007, 05:25 PM) View Post
Something else I found

QUOTE

I simply know that it takes 2-4 weeks (maybe more)
for those special fatty acids to replace the 'standard'
original ones in phospholipids of cell membranes and
lead to anti-aggregating & anti-inflammatory effects.
Accordingly, when you stop assuming them in your diet,
those effects persist for a few weeks.
This is what I remember from the first studies in '80s.
Some immediate anti-inflammatory effects after experi-
-mental intravenous administration have been reported.

I should check this 'cause it is just a vague memory...
You could read CLO topic and find other bits and pieces!


Maybe this has something to do with all of this as well, in terms of oil production from irritation as well? I foresee even more results in the next week or two


I've experienced great results with fish oil + resveratrol, since I started them both at the same time I can't tell which one is doing the most but I'd say its the fish oil. Since I started basically 90% of my oil production has decreased, however I am taking doses way higher than what many other people have tried. I'm running 24-28g of fish oil which is about 10g of EPA/DHA a day. See my thread here if interested.
http://www.acne.org/...p...=141074&hl=



wow i had no idea you were taking that much!!!!!

im taking 9 a day and things are going good.


Good to hear things are going good for you too sideways.gif
Yeah, im taking a a lot but it doesnt feel like much because i take 4 with every meal.


#26 acne_battle

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Posted 24 February 2007 - 11:53 PM

I just asked my dad what he thinks. Hes a paramedic and has been in the medical field for thirty some years. He is worried that if I take more than is directed to on the bottle that something bad could happen to me. I think for now I will just stick to the directions and take it twice a day.

#27 Case N

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Posted 24 February 2007 - 11:55 PM

QUOTE(xxndnromeoxx @ Feb 25 2007, 12:51 AM) View Post
Health Risks if overdosed:

* Increased bleeding can occur if overused (normally over 3 grams per day)
* The possibility of hemorrhagic stroke
* Oxidation of omega-3 fatty acids forming biologically active oxidation products
* Increased levels of low density lipoproteins (LDL) cholesterol or apoproteins associated with LDL cholesterol among diabetics and hyperlipidemics
* Reduced glycemic control among diabetics
* Suppression of immune and inflammation responses, and consequently, to decreased resistance to infections and increased susceptibility to opportunistic bacteria


I'm sticking to 3 grams


When you post such information could you also post references. thx

#28 bber

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Posted 24 February 2007 - 11:55 PM

QUOTE(xxndnromeoxx @ Feb 25 2007, 12:51 AM) View Post
Health Risks if overdosed:

* Increased bleeding can occur if overused (normally over 3 grams per day)
* The possibility of hemorrhagic stroke
* Oxidation of omega-3 fatty acids forming biologically active oxidation products
* Increased levels of low density lipoproteins (LDL) cholesterol or apoproteins associated with LDL cholesterol among diabetics and hyperlipidemics
* Reduced glycemic control among diabetics
* Suppression of immune and inflammation responses, and consequently, to decreased resistance to infections and increased susceptibility to opportunistic bacteria


I'm sticking to 3 grams


Im curious as to what medical study you found these side effects from. Especially since the 3 gram marker seems suspicious, it should be a unit based on mg/kg of body mass. Link us up?

#29 NdnRomeo

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Posted 25 February 2007 - 12:09 AM

QUOTE(casenickles @ Feb 24 2007, 11:55 PM) View Post
QUOTE(xxndnromeoxx @ Feb 25 2007, 12:51 AM) View Post
Health Risks if overdosed:

* Increased bleeding can occur if overused (normally over 3 grams per day)
* The possibility of hemorrhagic stroke
* Oxidation of omega-3 fatty acids forming biologically active oxidation products
* Increased levels of low density lipoproteins (LDL) cholesterol or apoproteins associated with LDL cholesterol among diabetics and hyperlipidemics
* Reduced glycemic control among diabetics
* Suppression of immune and inflammation responses, and consequently, to decreased resistance to infections and increased susceptibility to opportunistic bacteria


I'm sticking to 3 grams


When you post such information could you also post references. thx


Oh sorry about that, I found that on wikipedia. I don't trust the site itself, but the actual quotation/summary was from this governmental link

http://www.cfsan.fda...s/ds-ltr11.html

Not to say they're right or we're wrong, but overdosing scares me so I will stick to the normal suggested levels.

In all fairness, another site said that 3-8 does not show adverse side effects, so I'm just not sure right now, I'll post more when I find more information. I guess anything under 8 grams are fine?

#30 AutonomousOne1980

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Posted 25 February 2007 - 12:13 AM

QUOTE(ayla @ Feb 24 2007, 06:38 PM) View Post
QUOTE
The University of Iowa Cancer Center, Iowa City, 52242, USA. c-burns@uiowa.edu

The purpose of this study was to determine the maximum tolerated dose and dose-limiting toxicities of fish oil fatty acid capsules containing omega-3 fatty acid ethyl esters. Twenty-two patients with neoplastic disease not amenable to curative therapy who had lost 2% of body weight over a previous 1 month time period were given an escalating dose of fish oil fatty acids. The maximum tolerated dose was found to be 0.3 g/kg per day of this preparation. This means that a 70-kg patient can generally tolerate up to 21 1-g capsules/day containing 13.1 g of eicosapentaenoic acid + docosahexaenoic acid, the two major omega-3 fatty acids. Dose-limiting toxicity was gastrointestinal, mainly diarrhea, and a poorly described toxicity designated as "unable to tolerate in esophagus or stomach." A patient with chronic lymphocytic leukemia taking the fish oil provided an unusual opportunity to perform a detailed biochemical study of the effect of fish oil capsules on the lipids of malignant cells at several sequential time points in treatment. Studies of the malignant lymphocytes, serum, and whole blood of this one patient revealed an increase in eicosapentaenoic acid, the major component of the fish oil capsules, during fish oil capsule treatment. This study provides a scientific basis for the selection of omega-3 fatty acid doses for future studies in cancer. The maximum tolerated dose found is considerably higher than anticipated from published studies of many human diseases. The observation of a modification of the lipids of leukemic cells, serum, and blood in a patient with chronic leukemia provides a biochemical basis for a possible effect of fish oil supplements on cancer cachexia and tumor growth.


link: http://www.ncbi.nlm....p;dopt=Abstract


QUOTE

Prisco D; Paniccia R; Bandinelli B; Filippini M; Francalanci I; Giusti B; Giurlani L; Gensini GF; Abbate R; Neri Serneri GG
Institute of Clinica Medica Generale e Cardiologia, University of Florence, Italy.

Several studies have shown that n-3 polyunsaturated fatty acids (n-3 PUFA) are able to lower blood pressure (BP) in humans, but large doses of fish oils have been often used. Moreover, most of the studies available in the literature were not able to evaluate the specific effects of n-3 PUFA because they employed fish oils which contain, together with n-3 PUFA, many other different components. The aim of this preliminary study was to evaluate if medium-term supplementation with a moderate dose of highly purified eicosapentaenoic acid (EPA) and docosahexaenoic acid (DHA) ethyl esters is able to reduce BP in mild hypertensive patients. Sixteen mild essential hypertensive (diastolic BP: 95-104 mm Hg), non-diabetic, normolipidemic male outpatients and 16 normotensive male controls were recruited to participate in the study. Both hypertensive and control subjects were randomly assigned to receive either EPA and DHA ethyl esters (2.04 g EPA and 1.4 g DHA) as active treatment or olive oil (4 g/day) as a placebo for a period of 4 months. These subjects were followed up with 24-hour ambulatory BP monitoring and blood chemistry analyses at 2 and 4 months of treatment and 2 months after its discontinuation. The intake of n-3 PUFA was checked by red blood cell (RBC) phosphatidylcholine (PC) fatty acid composition. The effect of n-3 PUFA on BP in the active group was maximum after 2 months. Both systolic (-6 mm Hg, p<0.05) and diastolic (-5 mm Hg, p<0.05) BP significantly decreased during the n-3 PUFA ethyl ester supplementation. No further effect was observed at 4 months with a return to baseline values during the recovery period. These data indicate that 4 g/day of highly purified EPA + DHA ethyl esters are able to favorably affect BP in mild hypertensives.



link: http://www.medscape....bstract/9733153



QUOTE
Young GS; Conquer JA; Thomas R
Human Biology and Nutritional Sciences, University of Guelph, Guelph, Ontario N1G 5B6, Canada.

Dietary intake of omega-3 fatty acids has been positively correlated with cardiovascular and neuropsychiatric health in several studies. The high seafood intake by the Japanese and Greenland Inuit has resulted in low ratios of the omega-6 fatty acid arachidonic acid (AA, 20:4n-6) to eicosapentaenoic acid (EPA, 20:5n-3), with the Japanese showing AA:EPA ratios of approximately 1.7 and the Greenland Eskimos showing ratios of approximately 0.14. It was the objective of this study to determine the effect of supplementation with high doses (60 g) of flax and fish oils on the blood phospholipid (PL) fatty acid status, and AA/EPA ratio of individuals with Attention Deficit Hyperactivity Disorder (ADHD), commonly associated with decreased blood omega-3 fatty acid levels. Thirty adults with ADHD were randomized to 12 weeks of supplementation with olive oil (< 1% omega-3 fatty acids), flax oil (source of alpha-linolenic acid; 18:3n-3; alpha-LNA) or fish oil (source of EPA and docosahexaenoic acid; 22:6n-3; DHA). Serum PL fatty acid levels were determined at baseline and at 12 weeks. Flax oil supplementation resulted in an increase in alpha-LNA and a slight decrease in the ratio of AA/EPA, while fish oil supplementation resulted in increases in EPA, DHA and total omega-3 fatty acids and a decrease in the AA/EPA ratio to values seen in the Japanese population. These data suggest that in order to increase levels of EPA and DHA in adults with ADHD, and decrease the AA/EPA ratio to levels seen in high fish consuming populations, high dose fish oil may be preferable to high dose flax oil. Future study is warranted to determine whether correction of low levels of long-chain omega-3 fatty acids is of therapeutic benefit in this population.


link: http://www.medscape....stract/16188207

Unfortunately, none these have a thing to do w/acne, but they do show some very high doses being safely taken.


wow i can take that much? 60 grams seems like alot.

Thanks for joining me at the research front, now people wont think im making all this stuff up.hehe

#31 bber

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Posted 25 February 2007 - 12:13 AM

QUOTE(xxndnromeoxx @ Feb 25 2007, 01:09 AM) View Post
QUOTE(casenickles @ Feb 24 2007, 11:55 PM) View Post
QUOTE(xxndnromeoxx @ Feb 25 2007, 12:51 AM) View Post
Health Risks if overdosed:

* Increased bleeding can occur if overused (normally over 3 grams per day)
* The possibility of hemorrhagic stroke
* Oxidation of omega-3 fatty acids forming biologically active oxidation products
* Increased levels of low density lipoproteins (LDL) cholesterol or apoproteins associated with LDL cholesterol among diabetics and hyperlipidemics
* Reduced glycemic control among diabetics
* Suppression of immune and inflammation responses, and consequently, to decreased resistance to infections and increased susceptibility to opportunistic bacteria


I'm sticking to 3 grams


When you post such information could you also post references. thx


Oh sorry about that, I found that on wikipedia. I don't trust the site itself, but the actual quotation/summary was from this governmental link

http://www.cfsan.fda...s/ds-ltr11.html

Not to say they're right or we're wrong, but overdosing scares me so I will stick to the normal suggested levels.

In all fairness, another site said that 3-8 does not show adverse side effects, so I'm just not sure right now, I'll post more when I find more information. I guess anything under 8 grams are fine?

i've been taking 24g for almost a month now, i'll let you guys know if i die, or something =P

#32 NdnRomeo

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Posted 25 February 2007 - 12:15 AM

Sigh, so much information and I don't know what to do. I think we stress out half the time from just researching lol


#33 Case N

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Posted 25 February 2007 - 12:25 AM

QUOTE
i've been taking 24g for almost a month now, i'll let you guys know if i die, or something =P


Oh yeah totally let us know if you die. I would consider dying a negative, just me tho

#34 BigBeauty

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Posted 25 February 2007 - 12:41 AM

For what its worth, Dr. Cordain the paleo diet advocate in "Dietary Cure for Acne" recommends taking 2-4 g of both EPA and DHA. And I think this already assumes you're on a high omega-3 diet (fish, grass-fed beef, flax oil, oils with relatively descent omega 3/6 ratios).

#35 AndOceans109

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Posted 25 February 2007 - 03:30 AM

QUOTE(OhNoNotAnotherCysticPimple @ Feb 25 2007, 12:25 AM) View Post
I got a question about that. On Friday I purchased Omega 3 Fish oil supplements from GNC (1000 mgs) It says on the bottle to take it once to twice a day. If I took it three times a day is that considered an overdose? Sorry if thats a stupid question but I need to know the answer


lol you just uh lost your right to give anyone advice for anything on this board brother

#36 acne_battle

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Posted 25 February 2007 - 04:46 AM

What? You have a weird sense of humor

#37 NdnRomeo

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Posted 25 February 2007 - 09:29 AM


Also one of my main concerns is the high LDL levels. Fish oil raises bad cholestorol (ldl) in some people, it happened to my family when they went to take their blood test. Upon stopping, and switching to flax, it went away. So taking more than suggested may be a bit dangerous for myself, along with the fact that it thins the blood. Which could be scary.

But we all differ in our bodies, just monitor yourself and see how things go.

Good luck and be safe smile.gif

Get a blood test for sure if you've been on it a while and see what happens

#38 hrq271

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Posted 25 February 2007 - 10:44 AM

Flax oil is not bad per se, though probably less effective in balancing the omega-6 to omega-3 ratio. I'm a vegetarian, so I just take flax, though (although there are a few vegetarian DHA supplements). The only real benefit to taking flax if you're not a vegetarian, though, is that there's no chance of mercury.

#39 NdnRomeo

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Posted 25 February 2007 - 11:17 AM

QUOTE(hrq271 @ Feb 25 2007, 10:44 AM) View Post
Flax oil is not bad per se, though probably less effective in balancing the omega-6 to omega-3 ratio. I'm a vegetarian, so I just take flax, though (although there are a few vegetarian DHA supplements). The only real benefit to taking flax if you're not a vegetarian, though, is that there's no chance of mercury.


Fish oil is without mercury (the pills) so that's fine as well

#40 hrq271

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Posted 25 February 2007 - 11:29 AM

Hmm, whenever I read about fish oil, the recommendation is always: buy a high-quality brand, so that there is no mercury. I'm not saying you're wrong, but that's just what I've read.




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