15 replies to this topic

[radikal]

see
http://www.acne.org/messageboard/index.php...t&p=2576346

[{DC}]

radikal,

I find it hard to believe that Zinc and D3 can reduce sebum like Accutane does.

I actually take Zinc(not picinolate) and the vitamin D that comes in my fish oil(about 4000 IU) and I cant say I see much if any sebum reduction.

Maybe I need to take Zinc Picinolate and D3. The side of my fish oil tablets just says it contains 10,000 IU retinol and 1000 IU Vitamin D.

[Polska Laska]

radikal,

I find it hard to believe that Zinc and D3 can reduce sebum like Accutane does.

I actually take Zinc(not picinolate) and the vitamin D that comes in my fish oil(about 4000 IU) and I cant say I see much if any sebum reduction.

Maybe I need to take Zinc Picinolate and D3. The side of my fish oil tablets just says it contains 10,000 IU retinol and 1000 IU Vitamin D.

I've been taking zinc and vitamin d for over 3 years. I just started taking extra zinc about a month ago. My skin is as oily as it usually is, nothing changed. The only good thing is that I haven't gotten sick in a REALLY long time (thanks zinc!)

[radikal]

@bryan:

Hi, I seem to remember a thread where you mentioned a 5-alpha-reductase inhibitor (by Merck?) which worked in vitro but didn't pan out in vivo, or some such. Can you re-reference please?

How does this correlate with my (not quite conclusive yet - I will accept sebutape gifts reasoning in the thread linked above:
"Proposed mechanism of action: Zn is a 5-alpha-reductase inhibitor, which is the enzyme responsible for converting testosterone in dihydrotestosterone (DHT). DHT is known to modulate both keratin formation and sebum excretion rates."

[radikal]

radikal,

I find it hard to believe that Zinc and D3 can reduce sebum like Accutane does.

I actually take Zinc(not picinolate) and the vitamin D that comes in my fish oil(about 4000 IU) and I cant say I see much if any sebum reduction.

I did not say "like accutane does". I made a very specific statement of equivalence based on my skin's response to various isotretinoin dosages. I don't think you want to argue with *me* that particular point. I still have excess sebum at the current dose of Zn.pic+D3, but improvement is quantifiable (with admittedly crude methods); I blot an oil absorbing sheet at 5 hrs instead of 3 hrs.
Also, mechanisms of action are *very* different between isotretinoin and the one proposed for Zn. Isotretinoin hits right at gene expression, Zn later in the metabolic train wreck.

The reason for Zn picolinate + D3 is thusly: Zn picolinate is the Zn form most easily absorbed from all Zn compounds. In addition, an (unrelated to acne) study has shown that Zn absorption increases dramatically in conjunction with D3 vitamin. That is D3, not D.

[{DC}]

Sorry Radikal, I should have been more specific. I didnt mean to imply that you were claiming similar sebum surpression rates to that of a full blown Accutane course.

[bryan]

@bryan:

Hi, I seem to remember a thread where you mentioned a 5-alpha-reductase inhibitor (by Merck?) which worked in vitro but didn't pan out in vivo, or some such. Can you re-reference please?

I'm not sure what it is you saw from me in the past. Merck makes finasteride, but it has no effect on sebum. Finasteride is a specific 5a-reductase type 2 inhibitor, whereas sebaceous glands are rich in the type 1 enzyme.

Dutasteride (made by Glaxo), on the other hand, is a dual 5a-reductase inhibitor. It has the apparent potential to reduce sebum production, although to the best of my knowledge, there still are no published trials testing it for that purpose.

[alternativista]

Zinc and some other supplements made my skin a lot less oily. Accutane did nothing except give me chapped lips.

[{DC}]

radikal,

Is your sebum output still reduced?

Are you suspecting anymore reduction?

[radikal]

radikal,

Is your sebum output still reduced?

marginally so; perhaps I overestimated, it's more like analogous in reduction to 10mg isotretinoin (0.13mg/kg/day), which isn't much for my excretion rates. Still, better than nothing.
My zinc test shows my levels at the lower end of the acceptable range, so I'm clearly deficient; I've reduced supplementation to 44mg from 66mg since I intend to take it long-term and zinc overdosing can have serious consequences. See http://www.acne.org/messageboard/thoughts-...4912&st=40#

Are you suspecting anymore reduction?

am I expecting further reduction in excretion rates? No.

[{DC}]

thanks radikal.

10mg of Isotretinoin shut down my oil production pretty well.

I may try and get some of that zyflo.

[temp123]

FWIW I find that just about anything that kills the acne bacteria (P.Acnes) seems to reduce sebum.

I find that:

Hibiclens/hibiscrub, blue light treatment, peppermint oil, tea tree oil, triclosan all seem to do this for a few days or so, particularly with extended use.

I think that P.acnes causes irritation and that makes the skin increase the sebum secretion in an attempt to reduce the irritation. Perhaps that's what sebum's for; to physically block pores and stop irritating substances from entering. Of course it backfires in acne, because it seals in the bacteria.

[Fuman]

Anyone know what this is all about?

If someone is running some blind tests on a new sebum reduction drug?

http://www.wipo.int/pctdb/en/wo.jsp?WO=200...mp;DISPLAY=DOCS

It said in the claims that oxybutynin reduced sebum production

I googoled oxybutynin and it says that it's a oral pill for bladder control, but some of the side effects do include dry lips etc

*

hot, dry skin and extreme thirst;
*

severe stomach pain or constipation;
*

pain or burning when you urinate; or
*

urinating less than usual or not at all.

Less serious side effects may include:

*

dry mouth;
*

dry eyes, blurred vision;

http://www.drugs.com/oxybutynin.html

[radikal]

Anyone know what this is all about?

If someone is running some blind tests on a new sebum reduction drug?

make of this what you will:
http://oxybutynin.blogspot.com/

[Fuman]

Anyone know what this is all about?

If someone is running some blind tests on a new sebum reduction drug?

make of this what you will:
http://oxybutynin.blogspot.com/

meh thanks

[bec1999]

Zinc and some other supplements made my skin a lot less oily. Accutane did nothing except give me chapped lips.

Wow, how did you find out about oranges?! I eat them every day and acne problem since i was 13, I'm 31 now