1441 replies to this topic

[Loulu77]

Dear Bulgarian Doctor,

do you think your recommended therapy would bring other or better results when you use stem cells won from fat? Isn´t the concentration of mesenchymal stem cells in fat higher than in blood?
Thanks for answering, loulu

[dostoyevsky]

An update for those considering Stem Cell Treatment... get it done!

It's been almost 2 months since I had my treatment and I'm very pleased with the results. My skin isn't perfect and I still have some red marks but there is a huge improvement to both the look and texture of my skin. Apparently the best results are seen after 3 months but even at this stage I would say it's well worth it. With makeup on I don't even think about/stress over my skin anymore. I'll do a full report in a couple of months with some before and after photos.

A note to someone on here who discredited Dr Khan... his clinic isn't a charity! It's in Harley street so the rent alone on that place must be astronomical. He also has to pay for time spent in hospital for surgery, equipment etc and for the excellent staff he hires. He's got to where he is for a reason. He's damn good at what he does and he does care for his patients, unlike a lot of others who are just in it for the money. That's not to mention the long hours he works including nights and weekends. So I'm glad he gets paid well for what he does. I'd rather pay a higher price to someone with a good success rate and friendly nature than someone who doesn't care and is just interested in money. There's no need to be spiteful. If he wants to use my money to buy a new car then good for him, he deserves it.

I know there isn't that much feedback about the treatment yet but everything I've found on the net has been positive, whereas with other treatments, there will be cases of it not working or actually making things worse. As I said, I'll do a full report in a couple of months but for now I just encourage anyone who's considering it to go ahead and do it.

[Datura]

Hey! Thanks for the update. It's nice to hear that you're happy with your results.

[Loulu77]

Dostojevski, for those who cannot expect your before-after-photos could you describe the improvement of your skin in advance? What kind of scars changed in which way? Did enlarged pores minimize? Do you think the stem cell treatment can also repigment white scars?

[heidi55]

Hi BRD

Could you please PM me. I have the notes of my preocedure that I would like to discuss with you.

My skin was not red after treatment as was the case with the two other patients on this board. In fact I could leave the house immediately after, no prob, except I was puffy. I stayed with a doctor friend after the treament and he even said there were no injection sites other than where the fat was inserted.

So to answer your question there was no:" ( a ) needling, ( b ) subcision and ( c ) PRP injections before transplanting the ADMSC."

Remember, I was one of the very first to get treated so perhaps the doctor was still trying out new procedures. It is all trial and error with these new procedures.



Thanks very much!

Edited by heidi55, 16 November 2009 - 01:38 PM.

[Bulgarian R.]

Hi Heidi55,

I want to ask you if Dr. Khan performed ( a ) needling, ( b ) subcision and ( c ) PRP injections before transplanting the ADMSC. As I stated in a post 3 1/2 months ago (page 28, post #551), it is absolutely necessary that this be done, especially ( b ) and ( c ) in order to guide and confine the stem cells to the site of initial inflammation where they integrate themselves into the temporary platelet/coagulated blood scaffold. In other words, I do this in order to stimulate a regenerative response right where there is tissue atrophy. If Dr. Khan is not doing this then hypothetically only a small fraction of the stem cells will perform the specific localized regenerative action we require of them.

Icaretohelp told me that he did get the combined treatment I recommended, albeit not all on the same day (I favour getting all of it done within a 24 hour period in order to get maximal benefit from the concerted action of each procedural component). I don't know if Khan is trying different methods for different patients or if he solely perceives each of the aforementioned components as a standalone procedure that should not be combined into a single holistic treatment. Either way I'm trying to clarify this so that I can better evaluate what's going on here.

If you feel like talking, write me a note. Should you need specific information about my modus operandi I'll be happy to provide it to you.

BRD

Hi BRD good to see you back here on the forum ... not to rush you or anything but i was just wondering roughly when i would be able to get those before and after photos of your patients. im trying to get a few derms and hammermith hospital here in the uk to have a look into this treatment for acne scars but it would be much more convincing with photos. thanks

Hi v_singh,

If you want my before and after photos then please wait until June of 2010. At that time it will have been a little over a year after performing the procedure I summarised in post #551.

[Bulgarian R.]

Welcome back BRD i hope you update us with your results and the latest protocol you're following.

v_singh, do you have any letters or a neat document which describes the adult stem cells procedure clearly. I would also like to share it with my dermatologist. I'm not sure if she will be interested or not, but I would like to try. Anyway, let me know please if you or any1 else has something good to share with doctors. Thanks a lot

Hi unknown,

I am basically performing the very same procedure I described before. Long term I am considering the use of gene therapy (ie: Wnt pathway regulation), although this will be something that I will not incorporate commercially for at least another 3-5 years, if ever. After all, surprises in the form of new discoveries are almost always hidden behind every corner and they're revealed to us at an increasing pace, which makes it that much more difficult to accurately extrapolate current trends and likewise use them to predict the future. Most of the time new scientific developments allow us to incrementally improve the way we treat patients, but sometimes they completely shock us and cause a paradigm shift. Regenerative medicine as a field is experiencing an exponential growth of its knowledge base coupled to an unparalleled technological convergence rate. This means (pardon for stating the obvious) that what we know today is very limited relative to what we'll know tomorrow. You can read about new advances every single day of the week. Sometimes what seems like an incredible solution in 2009 may be replaced by something far more potent in say 2013 that was likewise discounted as pure science-fiction or even impossible just a decade earlier. Such are the times we live in. It's going to get pretty wild as the passing scenery becomes nothing short of dizzyingly blurry... Mark my words.

BRD is there anyway you could PM me with the exact steps and procedures involved. I am seeing someone in 2 weeks and would like to provide them with this to see if they would consider implementing it?

Would really appreciate any guidance as I do not want to raise something without really having any idea and right now I could not explain it myself without something set out.

Cheers

Hi otis20,

Did you get a chance to see what I wrote in post #551? I believe it may contain the information that you're looking for.

Edited by Bulgarian R. Dermatologist, 16 November 2009 - 11:06 PM.

[Bulgarian R.]

Dear Bulgarian Doctor,

do you think your recommended therapy would bring other or better results when you use stem cells won from fat? Isn´t the concentration of mesenchymal stem cells in fat higher than in blood?
Thanks for answering, loulu

Hi Loulu77,

I actually use adipose derived mesenchymal stem cells, although a small number of peripheral blood stem cells are also indirectly involved in the enhanced procedure I've been talking about.

Hi BRD

Could you please PM me. I have the notes of my preocedure that I would like to discuss with you.

My skin was not red after treatment as was the case with the two other patients on this board. In fact I could leave the house immediately after, no prob, except I was puffy. I stayed with a doctor friend after the treament and he even said there were no injection sites other than where the fat was inserted.

So to answer your question there was no:" ( a ) needling, ( b ) subcision and ( c ) PRP injections before transplanting the ADMSC."

Remember, I was one of the very first to get treated so perhaps the doctor was still trying out new procedures. It is all trial and error with these new procedures.



Thanks very much!

Hi heidi55,

I'll PM you tomorrow and we'll go over a few things. Bye for now.

An update for those considering Stem Cell Treatment... get it done!

It's been almost 2 months since I had my treatment and I'm very pleased with the results. My skin isn't perfect and I still have some red marks but there is a huge improvement to both the look and texture of my skin. Apparently the best results are seen after 3 months but even at this stage I would say it's well worth it. With makeup on I don't even think about/stress over my skin anymore. I'll do a full report in a couple of months with some before and after photos.

A note to someone on here who discredited Dr Khan... his clinic isn't a charity! It's in Harley street so the rent alone on that place must be astronomical. He also has to pay for time spent in hospital for surgery, equipment etc and for the excellent staff he hires. He's got to where he is for a reason. He's damn good at what he does and he does care for his patients, unlike a lot of others who are just in it for the money. That's not to mention the long hours he works including nights and weekends. So I'm glad he gets paid well for what he does. I'd rather pay a higher price to someone with a good success rate and friendly nature than someone who doesn't care and is just interested in money. There's no need to be spiteful. If he wants to use my money to buy a new car then good for him, he deserves it.

I know there isn't that much feedback about the treatment yet but everything I've found on the net has been positive, whereas with other treatments, there will be cases of it not working or actually making things worse. As I said, I'll do a full report in a couple of months but for now I just encourage anyone who's considering it to go ahead and do it.

I am very happy for you.

[otis20]

Is anyone else having problems looking through the thread? I can only look at pages 1 and then the last page so I cannot get to post 551. If anyone can see that post could they please repost it on the last page.

Cheers

[rian202003]

go to page 28

[otis20]

ye that doesn't work for some reason. When ever I go to another page it just list the very first post through to post 100. Can someone just repaste please.

Cjheers

[Vanzzzz]

Hi icaretohelp,

The doctor from Japan is only partially correct. On one hand it is true that stem cells tend to aggregate around sites of inflammation. This happens when say blood begins to coagulate in and around injured tissue. As it does this it releases specific growth factors that essentially tell the body that this particular site needs repair. That in turn drives a host of primarily immune, secondarily fibroblast and thirdly stem cells to that site. I've detailed the histological mechanisms in the "blood injection" thread I started about a year ago. Anyway, the doctor is not right about stem cells losing their efficacy during culturing. The reason I say this is that they can be suppressed from differentiating into less potent cell types with a number of growth factors, time management methodologies and critical population controls.

Post culturing, the procedure that I've developed involves four primary steps:

1) I perform subcision and needling at the site of each and every acne scar to be treated. This creates macro and micro damage at the deeper dermis and hypodermis levels. Inflammation occurs immediately.

2) Right after step (1) I inject a customized PRP solution that I've discussed before. The platelets aggregate at the site of injection and coagulate in and around the normal blood scaffold that has formed there from the subcision. As previously said, a concentrated number of growth factors is then naturally released by coagulating platelets that trick the body into thinking that there is a relatively serious injury in that particular area. At the same time additional GFs/proteins (artificially added to the PRP solution: TGF-b3, Thymosin-b4, Fetuin-A and Laminin 511) suppress hyper inflammation, which is itself counterproductive. They also help control the stem cell response. Right before injection the PRP is further enhanced by a injectable ECM solution that contains endogeneic ECM particulates.

3) I perform secondary subcision to recreate what I call endo-dermal pockets right through the already apparent haematoma. I then inject the stem cells into this same site. They are immediately guided by GF signalling in the area. Soon after they begin their work as they integrate themselves in the coagulated blood scaffold that is itself reinforced by the said ECM particulates.

4) 6 hours following the 3rd step I have patients undergo their first post treatment LLLT dose. This continues daily in the comforts of their own homes as they have personal LED panels with red and infrared light output. This helps to stimulate the regenerative histological activities post treatment and at the same time further controls the inflammation.

Some liken my technique to absolute overkill. Of course those who say this have never dealt with serious acne scars.

Cheers. Hope this helps u

[michael24]

Hi everyone I am very interested in this procedure and was wondering hat kind of scarring this would be best for.I noticed that there were some pics on the first page and people have had different opinions on whether they were minor of severe. I figured I would instead post pictures of scarring that is similar to mine. They are not what I believe to be severe but they bother me. They are for the most part indentations caused by larger pimples and a few very small pits almost look like enlarges pores. Would this procedure be beneficial?

Pictures of similar Scarring

[wishful thinker]

hi everyone,
just to let you all know i had stem cell treatment from dr khan yesterday and I found him very caring and understanding as is his staff! After the initial fat was taken from my abdomen the cells were cultivated then injected into my open pores and scars, and most areas of my face he also performed subsicion on some of the scars then went over my whole face with a very fine needle I think he was injecting the fat deep into the dermis (maybe!). at this time my face and stomach are swollen and bruised and i have a few blood spots over my face. i have an appointment 7th dec to go back and get skin taken from my neck he is then going to seperate and cultivate the cells to hopefully give me my pigmentation back on my face, i gather he is going to either dermabrase or laser my face before he injects and sprays the cells onto my face to form new skin. I will keep you all posted on my progress. As I have previously stated I found dr khan and his staff the nicest people I have met on my journey to have normal skin

[wishful thinker]

hi everyone,
just to let you all know i had stem cell treatment from dr khan yesterday and I found him very caring and understanding as is his staff! After the initial fat was taken from my abdomen the cells were cultivated then injected into my open pores and scars, and most areas of my face he also performed subsicion on some of the scars then went over my whole face with a very fine needle I think he was injecting the fat deep into the dermis (maybe!). at this time my face and stomach are swollen and bruised and i have a few blood spots over my face. i have an appointment 7th dec to go back and get skin taken from my neck he is then going to seperate and cultivate the cells to hopefully give me my pigmentation back on my face, i gather he is going to either dermabrase or laser my face before he injects and sprays the cells onto my face to form new skin. I will keep you all posted on my progress. As I have previously stated I found dr khan and his staff the nicest people I have met on my journey to have normal skin

[jaden]

BRD,
I have been trying to talk to you many times. Please can you offer me any advice?
I was overfilled with fat graft taken from my innerknee to my lips at age 23.
All the fat seemed to take. My lip is too big,and bulky the fat nodules are peppered all
throughout the lip region including under my nose. I have had several attempts at cutting some of these nodules out..some were removed and some may have grown back??
Do you think the constant trauma of trying to cut them out is causing a reaction
where they could actually be regenerating? I just dont understand why my lip is getting worse
and worse. I am assuming I have alot of stem cells in my lip. Do you know any doctors or any procedures that can help me to reduce all these fat graft nodules? I have heard of
a doctor injecting 5fu to reduce the fibroblasts in the f/g but it seems to me that would be
temporary? Then another uses steroid injections,and yet another lipodissolve.
I am desperate for some help here.
I would also like to know is MRI the only test that would show where exactly the fat grafts are
or is there some easier test like ultrasound?
I feel like its just going to keep getteing bigger and bigger since the effect seems
"cumulitive" please respond to me, or pm me.
I have had these grafts for 16 years now.

[heidi55]

Wishful Thinker

That is good news he did subsiscion before the stem cells. I bet he did needling too but you dont remember. lol.

You will get awesome results based on the two other patients who got that same procedure! Good job!

I am very happy for you.

XX Heidi55

[michael24]

Hi everyone I am very interested in this procedure and was wondering hat kind of scarring this would be best for.I noticed that there were some pics on the first page and people have had different opinions on whether they were minor of severe. I figured I would instead post pictures of scarring that is similar to mine. They are not what I believe to be severe but they bother me. They are for the most part indentations caused by larger pimples and a few very small pits almost look like enlarges pores. Would this procedure be beneficial?

Pictures of similar Scarring

Anyone?

[Bulgarian R.]

Hi everyone I am very interested in this procedure and was wondering hat kind of scarring this would be best for.I noticed that there were some pics on the first page and people have had different opinions on whether they were minor of severe. I figured I would instead post pictures of scarring that is similar to mine. They are not what I believe to be severe but they bother me. They are for the most part indentations caused by larger pimples and a few very small pits almost look like enlarges pores. Would this procedure be beneficial?

Pictures of similar Scarring

Yes, in the hands of a skilled doctor who performs a combination of subcision, PRP and stem cells injections you're scars would significantly improve to the point where they would be unnoticable. You could probably get satisfactory improvement with a simpler procedure, but I'm a firm believer in the "overkill" philosophy.

hi everyone,
just to let you all know i had stem cell treatment from dr khan yesterday and I found him very caring and understanding as is his staff! After the initial fat was taken from my abdomen the cells were cultivated then injected into my open pores and scars, and most areas of my face he also performed subsicion on some of the scars then went over my whole face with a very fine needle I think he was injecting the fat deep into the dermis (maybe!). at this time my face and stomach are swollen and bruised and i have a few blood spots over my face. i have an appointment 7th dec to go back and get skin taken from my neck he is then going to seperate and cultivate the cells to hopefully give me my pigmentation back on my face, i gather he is going to either dermabrase or laser my face before he injects and sprays the cells onto my face to form new skin. I will keep you all posted on my progress. As I have previously stated I found dr khan and his staff the nicest people I have met on my journey to have normal skin

That's awesome. I'm glad you're happy.

[jaden]

BRD what about my post, did you see it?