A Vegan diet is great because you have/are:

Getting more nutrients

Eating more fruits

Eating plenty of vegetables

Getting Loads of fiber (fruits, vegetables, whole grains, nuts, seeds legumes)

Getting Healthy Fats

Eliminated inorganic Animal protein (added hormones, antibiotics, etc)

Eliminated Saturated Animal Fat (contributes to hormone production & inflammatory products)



However as we both know not everyone on a vegan diet is a picture of health nor do they all have clear skin. The downside is that on a Vegan Diet one may still still:

Get too much Sugar

Eat Junk Food - candy, cookies, chips, etc

Get Trans Fats

Eat too many Fried Fats

Eat Refined Grains

Eat Gluten Grains - Wheat, Kamut, Spelt & Seitan (among other wheat varieties), Barley and Rye

Raw Brassica Vegetables - Those that are at risk for Hypothyroidism can't eat these raw. These should be cooked or fermented in order to deactivate the goitrogens. Members have gone vegen, specifically increasing their soy intake and ended up breaking out for the FIRST time or WORSE only to realize that it was because it made them Hypothyroid.

Plus whatever else may PERSONALLY affect you as an Individual.

Liver enzymes are different for each person because of how our ancestors evolved. The medical profession has only just realised this and is now looking at dosing of drugs according to ethnicity. The same applies to food. So just cos someone else can eat bread doesnt mean you can. People are also confused by the fact that their immediate relatives arent prone, so why are they? Sometimes a white couple have a black child due to a black ancestor, (which we all have BTW, thats why racism is ludicrous). Its just a throw of the genetic dice.

Sweetjade

I appreciate very much your postings. I plan to read them over more carefully later. I realize you have spent a lot of time working to figure all this out. You are undaunted by the task and we are very grateful to you!

Sweetjade

Whatever you do, you must never leave here . We u!

Aww. Thank you so much. It's so good to know that all of this isn't being totally ignored. Oh but you know what really made my day? A mom PMed me earlier and told me that thanks to all the (ridiculous amounts of) information and a hunch she took her daughter to see a Reproductive Endocrinologist, although just a regular Endo should be helpful.

Turns out that despite her lack of symptoms, she's kinda like me, the doctor assumed that she didn't have PCOS or Polycystic Ovarian Syndrome, but it turns out that she does. She's Insulin Resistant and has low SHBG levels (sound familiar) and since Diabetes Type 2 runs in the family and her mom also had undiagnosed PCOS, she really was a perfect candidate.

Yet the amazing part was that her mom felt that through a vegetarian diet she managed to keep her PCOS symptoms at bay and noticed that her daugher's skin improved when she stopped eating the sugar & sweets for several months. This was even more obvious when her daughter slacked on her diet and started breaking out again sometime prior to being diagnosed! So when the doctor automatically offered her Yasmin to treat this condition, she opted to go the diet route instead and because her daughter understands why she must eat a certain way and is seeing results, she's apparently quite happy to do so!

The sad thing is, the mom mentioned that both her dermatolgoist and reproductive endo knew very LITTLE about this and how to treat it, despite numerous journal articles on the matter....but the good thing is her daughter knows and that's what's most important.

I truly hope things are going well for you

Yup, I think thats a fascinating approach. Sure we are all made of the "same" stuff but we are also clearly quite different and these differences have not only shown that we can't all tolerate the same medications, but furthermore may very well mean that we are not all meant to eat the same diet as our best friend, next door neighbor, or even our doctor!

Apparently when it comes to diet, it's all about Nutrigenomics:

Our liver enzymes are so important, they indirectly affect both our mental and physical health. As I said Americans are having many ailments due to the quick culture shock to their liver enzymes. All non native americans are migrants in the last couple of hundred years (most native americans have also adopted the western diet at a terrible price). This compounded with the consumerist refining chemicalisation of foods is causing untold misery. Its interesting that obesity is becoming the biggest cause of cirrhosis and cancer not alcohol and cigarettes. Why? Cos most cultures have trained their bodies to accept alcohol and ciggies compared to refined carbs (such as white bread, biscuits, bagels, sodas), artificial sweetners and cows milk! My grandmother smoked like a trooper but ate very healthily. She lived to over a hundred and was always mentally sharp. I dont smoke BTW, I think its a disgusting habit.

3 out of 4 people have lactose intolerance to some degree and it gets worse as they get older. Gluten problems affect 1 in 7 people. And Yeast (a temporary problem) 1 in 3.
In fact if most acne sufferers follow a yeast avoidance diet (which takes care of the big gluten players and lactose intolerance (full fat cow's yoghurt which is allowed, though goats is better, a probiotic, is low in lactose)) coupled with getting rid of supplements and using natural products for body/hair/dental care they will with high probability (your problem is highly likely to be lactose 1st or yeast 2nd and to a lesser degree gluten 3rd) clear up significantly to totally within a month. The added benefit I found was losing 14lbs whilst remaining athletic, I didn't look fat to start off with. When I first tried the regimen I did things by halves and of course it didnt work. It was only when I had enuf of my skin, not sleeping well, moody, depressed, that I seriously did what the 'wierdos' had been preaching to me for decades and now I guess I'm a 'wierdo'. But its a small price to pay. It works!
The only 'vices' I have are caffeinated green tea max twice a day and vodka with mineral water (sometimes orange juice, very naughty ) a couple of weekends a month if that. I also have some root veggies, rice and oats occasionally which don't seem to harm me, although these go against the paleo ideal but are in line with yeast avoidance. Its incredible how dietary change affects sleep and mood as well as physical health.

I absolutely can relate to her pet peeves

QUOTE(SweetJade1980 @ Jul 12 2005, 09:10 PM)

QUOTE(goldengirl @ Jul 12 2005, 08:22 PM)

Sweetjade
Whatever you do, you must never leave here  . We  u!

[right][snapback]669011[/snapback][/right]

Aww. Thank you so much. It's so good to know that all of this isn't being totally ignored. Oh but you know what really made my day? A mom PMed me earlier and told me that thanks to all the (ridiculous amounts of) information and a hunch she took her daughter to see a Reproductive Endocrinologist, although just a regular Endo should be helpful.

Turns out that despite her lack of symptoms, she's kinda like me, the doctor assumed that she didn't have PCOS or Polycystic Ovarian Syndrome, but it turns out that she does. She's Insulin Resistant and has low SHBG levels (sound familiar) and since Diabetes Type 2 runs in the family and her mom also had undiagnosed PCOS, she really was a perfect candidate.

Yet the amazing part was that her mom felt that through a vegetarian diet she managed to keep her PCOS symptoms at bay and noticed that her daugher's skin improved when she stopped eating the sugar & sweets for several months. This was even more obvious when her daughter slacked on her diet and started breaking out again sometime prior to being diagnosed! So when the doctor automatically offered her Yasmin to treat this condition, she opted to go the diet route instead and because her daughter understands why she must eat a certain way and is seeing results, she's apparently quite happy to do so!

The sad thing is, the mom mentioned that both her dermatolgoist and reproductive endo knew very LITTLE about this and how to treat it, despite numerous journal articles on the matter....but the good thing is her daughter knows and that's what's most important.

I truly hope things are going well for you
[right][snapback]669063[/snapback][/right]

It may sound a little odd but i had goosebumps just reading your post. And I'm so enraged why dermatologists never cared about this existing science.

i got all that except last one brassica veg? are they just soy or others?

[offtopic] SweetJade1980 hi I have sent a pm to you. please take time to read thank you [/offtopic]

Yup Brassica Veggies are the good stuff, but there's also soy as well as a few others that can negatively affect a Hypothyroid person. Thus, the following can be Goitrogens, especially when raw, are:

Brassica Family (anti-cancerous, increase glutathione levels something that acne sufferers may be lacking, high fiber, calcium, etc):

Broccoli
Cauliflower
Brussel Sprouts
Cabbage
Spinach
Mustard
Kale
Collard
Turnips
Radishes
Rutabega
Horseradish
Kohlrabi
Canola Oil (Rapeseed)


Misc. Legumes
Soybeans
Peanuts
Lima Beans
Peas

Misc. Grains:
Millet
Corn

Misc. Nuts:
Pine Nuts
Walnuts

genus Prunus (of Rose Family)
Almonds
Peaches
[Nectarines]
Apricots
Cherries
[Plums]

Others:
Strawberries
Sweet Potato
Cassava
Watercress

As you can see these are some very healthy foods, some of which most of us rarely eat (enough of). So if you don't eat tons of it raw, it's not a problem, but if you do eat tons of these foods you may want to cut back some or cook them more often. This is particularly true of soybean consumption as members have stated that after becoming vegans or increasing their soy content (it can work for or against you) their acne got worse OR it GAVE them acne. Out of all of these foods, soybeans is something that Americans can consume daily and in a variety of ways (as a bean, protein, seasoning, "milk", "cheese" etc), so it makes sense that soybeans could be a big factor for members that chose to go vegan.

Of course the possiblity with soy is that it's being either overconsumed (compared to consumption in other countries), it's refined soy, or it's genetically modified as to why it may affect some members negatively. As for the other foods, well the ones I eat & have started increasing my intake of are brocolli, cauliflower, cabbage, and greens (spinach, turnips, kale, collard & mustard) but I eat brocolli the most, usually steamed, and none of these on a daily basis. Based on former thyroid tests I am high-normal for T4 hormone (converts into T3) so I guess i can afford to add some of these into my diet, especially since I wasn't eating these foods as often before (but I NEED the fiber & nutrients).

I honestly had no idea how many foods could be goitrogens, but again, some people that are hypothyroid don't have problems with ALL of these foods. Sometimes it's only certain foods and if you cook them, this will further decrease or deactivate this ability. Cooking for legumes & nuts & grains may simply mean sprouting, soaking or fermenting them. In fact one source said that soybean consumption should be avoided entirely unless fermented (Leo's Last Acne solution also reccomends this) and members of a rawfood community that are hypothroid have also noted problems with soy. I would suggest that if you or anyone else (that's hypothyroid) wanted to know if it's a problem I would avoid those that fall under being the top allergens first and then work your way through the rest of these.


Best wishes

Yo Sweetjade u are really full of knowledge, Are you a scientist or something? No ohnestly, im not tryin to be a funny guy... I do understand the whole acne diet connection. I wanted to know how trans fats can encourage inflammation.

Well, I have been drinking about half a litre milk everyday, eating "no-good-for-acne-food" ( Bodybuilding Diet ) for about two weeks now, I have not got any more acne. Maybe 3-4 spots since I started drinking milk so much. So for me, I really doubt there are any connection.

So probably, your liver has faster detox activity or acne sufferers with great effect on diet have something lacking against inflammation, oil poduction and lymph system

LOL, that's cool. Honestly not everyone will be affected by diet, BUT if you are affected, it doesn't mean that carbs or even dairy will be your problem. That's the thing, its so individual as to what foods will be an issue for you (there's plenty of possibilities) that most get confused or automatically think that diet plays no role for them. So if you look at the avoids list for those that are Hypothyroid (this can be another cause of acne), the Goitrogens, you won't find the tradiitonal processed foods listed there. Although, yes for some it's the wrong skin care, laundry detergeant, not changing the bedding enough, but for others its something more internal.

In fact, when people have allergies, how many things can be an allergen for them? Dust, mold, fur, pollution, foods (many types), right? Well the same goes for acne. It's called acne, but again skin problems tend to be a sign that's there's something in your environment (internal or external) that is imbalanced, "off" or problematic for you. (Most) Allergies, Intolerances, & Sensitivities can also be known as a form of Hypersensitivity, to seemingly normal things in your environment. Well there's been a few studies that have indicated that acne is a sign of another type of sensitivity, known as Delayed Type Hypersensitivity (DTH) and when you consider that apparently 90% of acne suferrers have been deemed merely "sensitive" to normal amounts of androgens, that already seems to set things in motion for DTH. With DTH, again, you can be hypersensitive to just about anything including BP, Spironolactone (two things that people rave about to help their skin), along with foods, chemicals, microoganisms, etc. So if you can find the problem, and getting a diagnosis can help, it usually goes away.


All the best!

Andrei,

If I really think about, sometimes I flip back and forth from being angry to being sad. I don't fault all doctors as I still believe in them and think that they have can play a huge role in preventative medicine. They just need to find the time or be willing to become more knowledgable about the "simple" things that affect our health.

The research was done before I was even born. PCOS had been defined before I was even born. Treating PCOS/IR through dietary means has been known since 1995, but because a % of acne sufferers develop acne during puberty, nothing was mentioned to me about this being a possibility. Although it should have been more of a tip off that I was actually not tha avg. pubertal teen as I went through premature adrenarche, also known as Precocious Puberty starting at the age of 8....HELLO that is not normal, LOL ;-)

Of course there are more hormonal and health problems besides IR or PCOS that an acne sufferer can have. http://www.acne.org/messageboard/MD-perspective-t58489.html (scroll down for associated disorders)

I know that some people may get annoyed that I bring it up, but it's important to do so because IF IF IF they do have a developing or permanent metabolic/hormonal disorder and they wait several years before they FINALLY investigate it, that time in between getting a dx or treatment, allowed for a worsening of signs and additional symptoms to be present. When I was 13 or 14 and got tired of going to Derms and messing around with herbs and went to my first Endocrinologist, had I been told about this, some of my symptoms would not exist! That's where the anger and sadness hits me the most...

Oh well, the important thing is that I know NOW! Instead of being bitter, cold, and skeptical to the point where I'll knock down even the remote possibility of certain theories or cures, I try to see if it's even a possibility. Unfortunately though many many members have been misled, hurt, disappointed and instead of actually contemplating the possibility of such things, a percentage tend to bicker and ignore evidence. I honestly thought that these message boards were supposed to be about creative brainstorming. Where we find a theory and we research about it and discuss whether it truly could be something useful for some of us. That was my ideal, and it's not something that you have to be scientifically minded to do, but just even attempting to see if there's some validity behind it, and not just taking possibly your doctor's uneducated word, would be a start!

Again, I have nothing against doctors, but some are far better than others. Some care more than others. Some have the ability to pay attention to the little things and when you come in for a completely unrelated problem, they decide to check you for something else aswell. The best part and the saddest part is that usually every bit of answers that I got wasn't because of how hard I worked to try to get a dx, but was usually because of some sort of fluke that lead the doctors to check something else about me. LOL, so when I put effort into it, it usually didn't pay off, but when I would forget about it, that's when they would pay attention...go figure. In the end, I could NEVER have gotten this far or a diagnosis had it not been for certain doctors and endocrinologists (3rd was the charm) that helped to give me a piece of my puzzle along the way.

So, what's your take?

it's not the doctors
its the FDA

my sister and my mum have underactive thyroid,i have never been diagnosed with it,was last checked a month ago.

I reccomend every body buy or just go to the library (If they have it) and read "Natural Cures 'They' Don't Want Your To Know About" by Kevin Trudeau. It reaveal alot about the food and drug industry like... Them putting chems in food that make you sick so that a drug company can make money of you buying there drug to supress that sickness, the food companies buy stocks in those drug companies so they can make even more money.

The food at our supermarkets are full of toxic chemicals that are slowly killing us and cause health problems.

Our diet should consist mostly of veggies. They say 1lb a day for each 50ld of you body weight.