Hi people.

this has been bothering me for a while. i have a degree in microbiology but i still don't understand why this happens. when bacteria such as p. acne grows in a blocked follicle it causes a spot.

the bodies immune system will quickly detect these microbes and begin to attacked using white cells on many types (mainly macrophages) this causes inflamtion dues to chemicles released by the white cells. as time goes by puss occurs signalling death of the bacteria then healing and repair phase.

once we have been exposed once shouldn't our immune system destroy any p .acnes in the follicle before a spot forms? this would be true for any microbe that invades our body. antibodies would still linger in the body, macrophages would be more effective against the bacteria and memory cells would be made. so why are we still prone to them?

Wouldn't regular sex cause it too? So you should all practice abstinence forever. Enjoy.

I have been thinking lately that acne may be our bodys way of lowering bad cholesterol in the blood.

I think it is related to obesity and heart disease. obesity- stores the extra cholesterol as body fat, heart disease the fat will just clog up the arterial walls, but with acne the fat is excreted through the sebum glands.

I read a study that says people with acne have low hdl and apolipoprotein levels, which are responsible for collecting excess cholesterol in the blood and shuttling it to the liver to be excreted. so if our body isnt able to do this it needs to find someother way to do it hence the sebum glands.

here is an article the American Journal of Epidemiology saying that people with acne have a 33% lower risk of heart disease. So this theory makes good sense. http://www.newscientist.com/article.ns?id=dn7541

Also phospholipase a2 has also been attributed to a survival mechanism to rid the body of excess cholesterol

Curr Opin Lipidol. 2007 Apr;18(2):147-51. Links
HDL cholesterol transport during inflammation.van der Westhuyzen DR, de Beer FC, Webb NR.
Department of Internal Medicine, Cardiovascular Research Center and Graduate Center for Nutritional Sciences, University of Kentucky, Lexington, Kentucky, USA.

PURPOSE OF REVIEW: The aim of this article is to review recent advances made towards understanding how inflammation and acute phase proteins, particularly serum amyloid A and group IIa secretory phospholipase A2, may alter reverse cholesterol transport by HDL during inflammation and the acute phase response. RECENT FINDINGS: Findings suggest that the decreased apoA-I content and markedly increased serum amyloid A content in HDL during the acute phase response result from reciprocal and coordinate transcriptional regulation of these proteins as well as HDL remodeling by group IIa secretory phospholipase A2. Serum amyloid A functions efficiently in a lipid-free or lipid-poor form to promote cholesterol efflux by ATP binding cassette protein ABCA1, evidently by functioning directly as an acceptor for cholesterol efflux as well as by increasing the availability of cellular free cholesterol. Serum amyloid A increases the ability of acute phase HDL to serve as an acceptor for SR-BI-dependent cellular cholesterol efflux. Altered remodeling of HDL by group IIa secretory phospholipase A2 in concert with cholesterol ester transfer protein may contribute to the generation of lipid-poor apoA-I and serum amyloid A acceptors for cholesterol efflux. SUMMARY: Current data support a model for the acute phase response in which serum amyloid A and sPLA2-IIa(phospholipase a2), present at sites of inflammation and tissue damage, play a protective role by enhancing cellular cholesterol efflux, thereby promoting the removal of excess cholesterol from macrophages.

phospholipase a2 is also the signal for cell membranes to release arachidonic acid yeilding pro-inflammatory eicosanoids that serve as ppar ligands binding to nuclear receptors. Ligands for ppar have proven to be potent mediators for sebum production.


Hopefully ive been able to link acne as a defect in fat metabolism and its relation to heart disease, and also phospholipase a2 for its role in not only fat metabolism but also pla2s role in sebum production.
Uniting sebum production with the bodys survival response to lower excess cholesterol.

Ill update this as i continue my research.

Just wondering if any of the clever people on this site had any ideas on this one. I've been trying to figure out a link between Biotin and Sebum for a while.

This was mainly down to personal experience. When in the past by sebum had dropped down to almost nothing, due to B5 at one point, and Accutane at another. Addition of Biotin seemed to increase the amount of Sebum on my face. It may have not increased it beyond pre accutane/B5 levels, but seemed to restore it to similar. Drop the Biotin and the oil seemed to go away.

If I google Biotin causing cystic acne (which was my main issue), there seems to be quite a few cases of people with hair issues supplementing Biotin, only to find out cystic acne comes there way, having not had it before. They stop the Biotin, their cystic acne goes away. I can't help but feel there is a link there somehow.

Biotin often seems to get ignored on its effects in nutrition, as it can be created by the body itself to my understanding. I'm almost wondering if some of us who have cystic acne/lots of sebum, we have too much Biotin being created (maybe in relation to other vitamins, like B5?).

I also notice one of the side effects of lack of Biotin is dry skin, so it does seem to affect the skin somehow, but again dry skin may be unrelated to sebum, but what is the indication for too much Biotin ? I'm sure there is some effect, even if by competing with other vitamins.

I can see some very loose links to insulin as an example http://endo.endojournals.org/cgi/content/full/140/10/4595 , but not really anything concrete. Has anyone come accross anything like this before at all ? I can remember years back Craigy on these forums was pondering a link at the same time, but never knew if anything came of it.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1990740...mp;ordinalpos=2

... post some more, if u like..

Hey guys so Im not sure if I found whats causing my acne just putting things togher figure I would throw it up here I see what you guys think first I'll give lil back ground. Im 22 male had severe body acne, chest shoulders back since about age 15 or so. Tried just about evething, been on antiboitics for about 2 years now hate it, never took acutane been offered it but refused lookign bakc I should have done it while I had the chance but anyway, I finaly got a physical first time in a couple years and foudn out that I have a testicular varicocele. After going to a urolgist and looking into to evidnetly it lowers sperm count and could case me to become infetile. Also after some reseach I found that it lowers testorine in the body. This might not be my the reason but do you think it has any connection with my acne problem possiably? I am going to have surgery to get it fixed in the near future I guess only time will tell

The effect of daily consumption of probiotic and conventional yoghurt on oxidant and anti-oxidant parameters in plasma of young healthy women.

I presume the researchers were hoping to find that probiotic yogurt was "healthier" than ordinary yogurt. What the study seemed to show, however, was that both forms significantly reduced serum antioxidant levels and, if anything, the probiotic form had worse effects.

This raises the possibility that yogurt may offer it's own special mechanism for worsening acne, apart from just being a dairy product, and also is not really a cheery note about using probiotics.

Ive read topics in internet about mastubation, there was said that mastubation does not causes acne, but it is not true ! (sorry for my bad english)

Masturbation in males helps to convert male hormone Testosterone to more potent Dihydrotestosterone, which is 5 times bad for acne than Testosterone...

Testosterone + 5-a reductase = Dihydrotestosterone (bad news)

i was desperate about that, i had difficulty to give up masturbation but now i did not mastubated for 2 weeks and my skin is almos clear now!

I noticed that people who live in hot, humid climates tend to have larger pores and oilier skin while those who live in cold, dry climates tend to have smoother, poreless skin.

Is there a correlation between environment and pore size?

As this topic is constantly being debated I thought it might be a good idea to create some sort of formal post (perhaps starting with this thread) for all the reasons one might fall victim to increased oil production.

I'm thinking hard science here (so, at the least we can show the doctors)

for example, "hormones" would be too simple (and not very helpful) - something specific as to which hormones - whats going on with them and why

masturbation - any specific scientific tests?

stress/anxiety - same deal

and of course.... overwashing - but that's too general - specific cleansers - specific chemicals - BP - SA - use of exfoliants - harsh scrubbing

I'd like to ask people to only post real scientific theories/tests, or if is their own theory that they at least tested it using scientific method to some degree.

My hope is to collect all the important info, filter out the junk, and then assemble it into something that is helpful to people.

Accutane decreases the sebum output on not just the facial skin but also reduces the lubricants in other parts of the body as well. Clearly we don't want that.
Shouldn't scientists find a way to destroy the sebaceous glands on the face so it doesn't produce so much oil? I have heard some lasers can do that. Anyone know which ones and can it used on brown skin?

Okay I'll make this simple. I was sick of hearing about this masterbation talk so I decided to try it myself. I went without anything for a week and than masterbated atleast once a day the following week, having sex mid-week too.

Results: After about 4 days without masterbating, I DID CLEAR UP. I couldn't believe it. Now saying that, it could have been a 'good week' but what leads me to believe otherwise is the fact that on the second week, I broke out. You know even whiteheads were clearing up and just my face in general was clearing up on the first week.

It is very hard to give up sex and masterbation so I don't know what I'll be doing from here on. I will try to limit sexual experiece to twice a week and see where that leads me. I don't have any motive here to promote anti-masterbation but seriously, after about 4-5 days into the first week, my skin cleared up. Of course I have bad scarring and bad cysts but the cysts and pimples and whiteheads were getting better. I will have to try and limit myself until new years to see what happens I guess.

Hey! I know since this year Summit will test in people with acne this drug which can reduce 90% the sebum production.

Someone mainly from UK or Europe (the Lab is from UK) can contact them to join these clinical trials and share that amazing experience with us?

I also know the labs usually have a very confidential policy but maybe not only one of you can have success and try this drug but comment to us some results.

If you are from those countries I guess you don't lose anything to try.


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Thank you

Ariel

Hey y'all!

Did some googling the other day and found that there's a vaccine under development right now that may do the trick. There's a scientific paper titled 'Vaccination Targeting a Surface Sialidase of P.acnes: Implication for New Treatment of Acne Vulgaris' that speaks of a new treatment for acne. The treatment relates to a vaccine that reduces the activity of the p. acnes bacteria.

As a result of the research mentioned in the article, a company has started the development of a vaccine. The company name is VAXIN and there's a press release entitled 'VAXIN RECEIVES $100,000 GRANT FOR DEVELOPMENT OF ACNE VACCINE'.

Coincidentally lots of people are currently looking at vaccines against virus' like swine flu. Looks like one of the same mechanisms used by the flu to get into your cells is the same used by p. acnes (a molecule called 'sialidase'). The vaccine prevents sialidase from working thereby stopping p. acnes from multiplying out of control.

It's early days for the vaccine but the ball is rolling! This is really fantastic news folks!

Folks if you're interested in finding out about what research is going on in the acne field, search for 'sz95' on pubmed. sz95 is the name for a line of sebocyte cells (sebum producing skin cells) that live forever. The fact that they live forever mean that they are very useful for skin research. You can grow batches of them in an artificial environment to perform experiments on.

The proposal made by Vaxin to receive the grant says that the project starts 5 sep 2008 and ends 31 aug 2009. So we'll find out soon how the project has turned out.

I was thinking before.
Acne is caused by bacteria, right? P.Acnes, I believe.
And isn't it the job of the body's immune system to fight off infections? If you have a strong immune system, can your immune system learn to fight P.Acnes?

If so, I guess the question would be- How do I build my immune system?

I do research at a major university and was wondering...Have any of you had any problems with autoimmune diseases as well? Specifically I have been wondering if there is any correlation between acne and:

Ulcerative Colitis
Crohn's Disease
Periodontitis

Other autoimmune diseases include Lupus and Type I Diabetes.

I don't have any new research to post, but I was hoping people who have come across genetics research or even from your own experience could help me out.

So, my dad, who I happen to take after looks-wise, just told me he had acne well into his thirties and still gets the occasional spot...this news is devastating to me..

However, my mom tells me my dad did not have acne when she met him at exactly 30 years old. I don't know who's memory is failing here - I hope it is my dad's but anyways, I am 27 and still have acne (for about 13 or 14 years now) and I guess I want someone to say "Don't worry, you won't necessarily follow your dad's pattern."

Here's the thing though, can someone post scientific research showing the correlation between parents' and children's acne, percentage-wise. How strong or weak is the correlation? I know there are people who come from families where acne is practically non-existent but they have a pretty bad case, but how about the opposite scenario, where one or both parents had bad or chronic acne, yet the kids lucked out? Many thanks!!!

I feel like I am going crazy because of my acne, well not because of acne but mostly because the majority of the population dont or just rarely have it; so its a Huge disadvantege for me and I belive for every sufferers.

So the thing is I'd like to list the theories to cure acne but on the web I cant really find theories but mostly general (batshit and bullshit) information.

I'd greatly appreaciate if you could post your theories/cures or the ones you have found so anyone who enters this topic will see them all at one place (a word, sentence or even pages long I dont care but make it comprehensible , but it can be detailed too).

Heres the list:

B5 deficiency theory

Theories about Diet

Caused by toxins

Liver problems

Hormone imbalance, especially for women, including estrogen dominance and PCOS

Zinc Deficiency

Widespread Inflammation

Thyroid problem

Insulin intolerace

I have been noticing this for a while, but now that I am off the meds it has become very aparent to me that when I have a breakout wearing sunscreen for 24 hours straight seems to reduce the inflamation and subside the acne. I am not the type who pays too much attention to things like this but this didn't escape me.


Personally I can't think of any other reasons for this other than the hight concentration of Zinc Oxide in my sunscreens.


I am very tempted to try this by staying off meds and wearing sunscreen at all times. I was thinking of my synthetic one during the day and an organic one at night and see how things go. Both product having high % of Zinc Oxide.


Has anyone observed anything similar to this??

Being the nerd I am,

I research a lot in regards to acne. I am into lifting, and a while I ago, I bought biotest's res-v. A little while I ago, I too testosterone boosters, which resulted in painful nodules all over my face. I immediately quit taking all lifting supplements cause I was scared to aggravate my condition any farther. I also got pretty lazy in lifting. Well recently I have decided to get back into it and I came across this bottle. I wanted to take it but, it said testosterone supporting formula, so I googled it and to my suprise Resveratrol is benefical to acne!

I put it in the search button and came across very helpful posts by autonomous. In my other thread, Jemini posted an interesting idea about PPARs and how they might affect acne.

Apparently resveratrol is a potent 5 lipoxygenase inhibitor. 5 lipoyxgenase converts arachinodic acid into pro-inflammatory leukotrines. According to the studies posted by autonomous, these leukotrines can stimulate the sebaceous glands. Arachinodic downregulates PPARs, which affect rxr receptors, just like how accutane works!

In additionm, resveratrol is a CYP1A1 enzyme inhibior. CYP1A1 is an ezyme that encourages the breakdown of retinoic acid which maybe be the reason why the cells in our skins begin to disfunction, resulting in hyperkeratinization.

Here is a study of topical resveratrol and acne:
http://www.freepatentsonline.com/20010056071.html

not entirely pointless, but here me out.

our method for studying biological systems as an attempt to apply this knowledge to medicine is somewhat justified, but does finding out alot about a disease in order to manipulate it really going to give us the answer?? it will give us treatments but that may be it.

with the exception of genetic diseases and those hard core defects, i suspect the only thing in the end that we will modify is the bacteria in the gut, the condition of our mind as it relates to our environement, and our diet. Beyond that i believe all the details are somewhat pointless and useless.

Also many studies show the mind to be a variable in disease, but its factors are immeasurable, except by you, only you know what you feel and what can make you feel better, or at least first hand anyways, this is a bit out of the range of accurate science, but i just dont see all these diseases being solved without addressing the mind. Science has found precise connectinos of the mind to the immune system, but these connections become detectable via the emotions and moods we experiance, we know what feels good and feels bad, somewhat making any scientific discovery of this connection useless unless we learn to harness it.

to scientifically reach a state of happiness would be an interesting one, a theory of happiness is what we need, then a series of steps which instill this.

A theory of happiness?? silly hey?? or an explanation as to why happiness does or does not occur.
Identifying human emotional needs as if identifying vitamins, crucial to the health of the soul and the mind.

Think about it. Supposedly when we masturbate and ejaculate testosterone gets converted to DHT, which stimulates oil glands.

Also, from like ages 1 - 12, when virtually everyone is perfectly clear, no kid at that age masturbates/ejaculates. But from like 13 - 18, teens are masturbating and ejaculating multiple times a day and breaking out like crazy all the time.

Maybe when we first start masturbating/ejaculating at say age 12/13 it tells our bodies to start making more sex hormones/androgens.

I can attest to this. I'm an 18 year old male and masturbate quite a bit. Usually 1 - 3 times a day. I have very oily skin and a lot of acne. But I want to abstain from masturbation for a week. If I can go that long I'll go for a month. If I make it then I'll go for a year. Maybe then my skin will be less oily?

Why do some people start breaking out at 12/13 while others don't get any acne until like age 18? Could it be related to masturbating habits?

So i use to have terrible acne from the ages of 12-15. I tried many products, and it finally cleared up when i stopped using all products 1.5 years ago. So for about 2 years now i have been using nothing on my face, nothing! Just water from my daily shower. It worked for 1.5 years. I also don't believe that for that 1.5 years i masturbated. I really thought it was over, until 7 months ago when i started working out 3 times weekly for the first time in my life. It began with little red bumps on my forehead, these looked like heat bumps and didn't come to heads. I actually still have these on my forehead. I'd say around 5 months ago i started tanning in a booth, and continued for 2 months. When i stopped i started getting more and more pimples. Just the occasional, but they kept adding up. Now they are spreading from my chin to my cheeks. As of right now it's only 1 cheek, but I'm scared it will spread to the other. I don't want my face to be as bad as it use to be. Help ME!

I have many questions, and a dermatology appointment on Dec 1st. But that's just so long, and i need results quick before it gets worse.

1) Should i tan again? It seemed to help. It wasn't that expensive, but i was always red!

2) Do you believe masturbation and acne has a slow response? I haven't masturbated for 2-3 months, no problem. Maybe it'll clear up??

3) Should i take a pill? Birth control, etc?

4) Currently I'm not using any topical medication, it seemed to work for 1.5 years. Should i start again??

5) If i do start any type of medication, when i stop, will it come back??

6) When taking the survey on acne.org, it recommended Zinc and Fish oil... Should i go for it?? And again, when i stop taking them, will the acne come back.

I have more questions that i can't think of, but any answers would be greatly appreciated.

Thank you!!

To anyone who's interested, I came across this article on the internet today:

Cipher CP-Isotretinoin

Here's an excerpt:



It's going to be a while before this drug enters the market, but it's closer to that than SMT-D002. I've researched a little on Accutane and ever since Roche stopped marketing their drug, it appears the generic brands of Accutane do not work as well. I could be wrong on this, but it's sad to hear about acne returning after a course or two of Accutane. Given that, here is some information that would be of use to everyone. (If at all). Thanks!

What is the effect of blacklighting on skin? if any.